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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2017 17:24:09 GMT
Seems to me that there's a difference between forwarding an email with comments criticising the club and creating an email abusing them. I understand this event is owned by the fans, but obviously is dependent on cooperation never previously withheld or subject to such objectionable conditions. I hear that KM and this lady had a run in a couple of years ago when the CEO objected to Rick Everitt speaking about the Valley Party. It was petty then - KM was an invitee at someone else's event - and it's even more petty now. The Player of the Year event should, in my opinion, be a given every year. It's a formal event for adults, organised by fans and supported by the club in partnership. I don't see any reason why that should change, especially as the CEO has made such loud noises about building bridges with the fans. Regretfully this situation reeks of building bridges only with those fans who will just go along with what she wants. That's incredibly immature and hardly behaviour suitable to someone of her seniority,let alone in the best interests of the club. Let's be honest, it reveals the whole series of fans meetings as a PR exercise on behalf of a failing CEO desperate to get her career back on track, to be seen to be doing the right things despite investing precisely nothing emotionally in them. Another bridge burnt rather than built, by a CEO who behaves exactly opposite to what she says. They do not want partnerships with Charlton fans, they want to control them. Anything they can't control they won't tolerate.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 12, 2017 17:44:46 GMT
That's it blame the club, Jesus Christ where do some of you people get off? Some of you should go over to the dump where she posts and have a look at her comments about KM & RD going back a few months .
She is a motor mouth who can't keep it shut therefore she's got what she deserves, anybody can arrange a POTY year event FFS!
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Post by canaddick on Mar 12, 2017 17:52:40 GMT
I genuinely mean no offense here buddy, but you must see the double standard in that? The CEO was prepared to meet with you despite some posts you yourself have admitted were somewhat abusive. Why shouldn't this lady be afforded the same generosity? Both from the CEO and you?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2017 18:30:13 GMT
I genuinely mean no offense here buddy, but you must see the double standard in that? The CEO was prepared to meet with you despite some posts you yourself have admitted were somewhat abusive. Why shouldn't this lady be afforded the same generosity? Both from the CEO and you? The difference is that reams made a very heart-felt and genuine apology several weeks before the meeting - I saw it and was even quite moved by it. And I might add that it was received by the CEO with great magnanimity. It takes a big man to say 'sorry' but "this lady" , as you call her, has never apologised for anything and continues to maintain a barrage of unlady-like abuse against the club and its employees - it's only eight or nine days ago she was urging the demonstrators in Belgium (of whom I think she was one?) to "test" the owner's "dickey-ticker". If she had apologised, then I'm sure she would not have been declared persona non grata by the club. As it is, she has brought it upon herself and her recklessness has caused the cancellation of the POTY event.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2017 18:34:51 GMT
- No POTY this season.
- No relationship with the Supporters' Trust.
- 6,000+ drop in home attendance.
- Season ticket prices slashed but no increase in ticket sales.
- Bottom half of League One.
- Ongoing protests and factional fighting among fans.
All of the above have one thing in common. It isn't CARD or CAST or Rick Everitt or Peter Varney or Jean Huelin or any other individual. These people and groups are involved in one or more of the points of contention listed above (or others not listed) but only one party is common to all of them. So the root of the problem lies either with the Duchatelet administration at CAFC, or a huge conspiracy against it. A conspiracy of all the other groups and individuals already mentioned plus many more, and all the Charlton supporters who no longer buy season tickets and come to the Valley anymore. Supporters, many of whom have previously remained with the Club through other tough times prior to 2014. That hardly seems likely, does it.
I accept that nobody is whiter than white by now. Nobody has come through a year and a half of bitterness and division without getting their hands dirty to some degree, and some more than others. And there are some people opposing the current owner who have their own agendas or axes to grind. But by reason and common sense alone, who is more likely to be responsible for the sorry state of affairs we now find ourselves in? A) An owner with no previous connection or affinity to Charlton Athletic or to English Football before he arrived, who has completely restructured the way the Club operates and the way it behaves towards its supporters since the spring of 2014. B) Thousands upon thousands of Charlton fans, many of whom who have been loyal followers of their Club since the early 1990's when Charlton returned to the Valley (and some for longer than that) who are being hoodwinked by a conspiracy of disgruntled ex-CAFC employees and trouble makers (individuals who are being constantly lampooned on this forum as being incompetent fools). The fans who no longer come to the Valley are Charlton people. People who followed the team before 2014 but are being lost in ever greater numbers since our last change of ownership. Roland Duchatelet does not have to be a Charlton person in order to gain the respect and cooperation of Charlton's fan base. Long gone are the days when Club owners had roots in the local community. But new owners (even foreign ones from very different cultures) are expected to show some measure of sympathy with the values of the life-long local supporters of the Club they have just acquired. Duchatelet has never made any effort whatsoever to build bridges with Charlton fans, or to convince them that he has the interests of their Club and their team at heart. We have had nothing but empty words, presentations and meetings. Talk is cheap, especially when the lack of respect for fans extends to not bothering to be honest with them. Duchatelet's actions since buying CAFC clearly show he has no interest in the Club beyond its potential to be an asset in his business portfolio. Again, by his actions and those of his CEO it is clear that he never had any interest in fostering good relations with Charlton supporters, who were regarded as customers in the early days but no longer have any value to him at all, since so many now refuse to pay for the product his company is offering. The current administration at CAFC has taken all the important decisions since 2014 which have led us to where we are today. They hold all the power. They are also control freaks who do not trust anybody who is not bound by a contract to obey them. Every fan can form his/her own conclusions. But I know who I hold primarily responsible for the current situation.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2017 20:30:29 GMT
Seems to me that there's a difference between forwarding an email with comments criticising the club and creating an email abusing them. I understand this event is owned by the fans, but obviously is dependent on cooperation never previously withheld or subject to such objectionable conditions. I hear that KM and this lady had a run in a couple of years ago when the CEO objected to Rick Everitt speaking about the Valley Party. It was petty then - KM was an invitee at someone else's event - and it's even more petty now. The Player of the Year event should, in my opinion, be a given every year. It's a formal event for adults, organised by fans and supported by the club in partnership. I don't see any reason why that should change, especially as the CEO has made such loud noises about building bridges with the fans. Regretfully this situation reeks of building bridges only with those fans who will just go along with what she wants. Thats incredibly immature and hardly behaviour suitable to someone of her seniority,let alone in the best interests of th club. Let's be honest, it reveals the whole series of fans meetings as a PR exercise on behalf of a failing CEO desperate to get her career back on track, to be seen to be doing the right things despite investing precisely nothing emotionally in them. And now the full truth comes out. Jean Huelin wrote an e-mail dissing club staff as useless ... which she intended to send to Ian but instead sent to the very people she was slagging off. As a result she wasn't banned from the event but was merely told that she was not to communicate with the staff members she had disrespected. You don't have to be a genius to work out that: (i) the staff she had abused told the CEO that wanted nothing more to do with their abuser (ii) the CEO has a duty of care to her staff under tort law to protect them from abusive 'customers'. Can you imagine what CARD/CAST/CL/VOTV/WAR would have said if Katrien Meire had written an e-mail to Tony Keohane saying Jean Huelin was an incompetent idiot who couldn't organise a piss-up in a brewery... and had then sent it to Jean Huelin "by accident"? They would hve declared WW3. Sorry canaddick, but not for the first time today, your hypocrisy stinks.
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Post by canaddick on Mar 12, 2017 21:03:48 GMT
Wow. Well thanks for the compliment. I guess my prophecy on the other thread wasn't far off.
You're trying too hard buddy. You've created a hypothetical situation, attributed my opinion to it and then criticised me for something I never said in the first place. You're quite transparent, friend, your weakness is you think you're better at it than you are. God bless you.
Quite obviously I cannot speak for CARD, CAST or anyone else and, unlike you, wouldn't presume to speak for others.
Look, back in the real world if that's really all the lady wrote then it can hardly be defined as abuse unless you desperate want it to mean that. She's expressing an opinion to someone else on a matter she's clearly passionate about. Thinking someone an idiot is not abuse or we'd all be in trouble. It's no more abuse than you contriving an accusation of hypocrisy I would say.
I've not read the email, so if it is genuinely abusive then of course she's in the wrong. Frankly speaking I can't imagine the other organisers cancelling if she had been.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 12, 2017 21:06:48 GMT
Ducking and weaving again, eh?
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 12, 2017 21:22:33 GMT
Wow. Well thanks for the compliment. I guess my prophecy on the other thread wasn't far off. You're trying too hard buddy. You've created a hypothetical situation, attributed my opinion to it and then criticised me for something I never said in the first place. You're quite transparent, friend, your weakness is you think you're better at it than you are. God bless you. Quite obviously I cannot speak for CARD, CAST or anyone else and, unlike you, wouldn't presume to speak for others. Look, back in the real world if that's really all the lady wrote then it can hardly be defined as abuse unless you desperate want it to mean that. She's expressing an opinion to someone else on a matter she's clearly passionate about. Thinking someone an idiot is not abuse or we'd all be in trouble. It's no more abuse than you contriving an accusation of hypocrisy I would say. I've not read the email, so if it is genuinely abusive then of course she's in the wrong. Frankly speaking I can't imagine the other organisers cancelling if she had been. Why do you call everyone buddy?
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 12, 2017 21:23:57 GMT
Can we leave it there guys because it's breaking out on every thread at the moment and I don't want it.
She made a mistake, there is no POTY to be organised by here under this regime so that's the end of it.
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Post by canaddick on Mar 12, 2017 21:29:11 GMT
Common where I live Reams. Force of habit.
Probably best leave it there, as reading the email in another place it seems people aren't prepared to be honest here.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 12, 2017 21:35:16 GMT
I'd appreciate it if you and IA could agree to disagree or if you must argue via PM.
I was informed of the email last week word for work and take it from me 100% the more truthful version has been put on here long before it was anywhere else.
She is bound to get the support elsewhere because as we have said before CARD, CAST, WAR and CL are all the same people who back each other up so no offence but more fool you for believing otherwise.
The email appeared on here three days ago and on CL tonight so work that one out, you got the unedited version on ITTV.
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Post by canaddick on Mar 12, 2017 21:54:22 GMT
Sure, could you link me to it as I cant find it.
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Post by overthetop on Mar 12, 2017 22:10:43 GMT
Me too, as I can't see it on this thread.
Did she call them domme mensen or vinegar pissers? Or did she suggest they couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery?
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 12, 2017 22:41:52 GMT
As a point of information and making no judgment here, please see this extract from a post made by Ian Wallace elsewhere: "I have read with interest the comments following my original post yesterday evening. I am very appreciative of the support from just about everyone but would like to correct a couple of points as I am anxious that this sorry incident be correctly reported and do not want to be unfair to anyone.
On 7th February Fanny was angry about the fact that the club had blocked our original plans for the POTY and fired off an email intended for me but mistakenly sent it to a member of the club staff. As a result of this email, I was first told that we could go ahead with the Dinner but that she could not be involved in the organisation. This was later amended whereby she could now be involved, but must not communicate directly with any of the club staff as she had been so disrespectful to them. It was this decision and nothing else which forced us to cancel the whole event."
All I would ask is that people review their positions and take this for what it is - a personality clash with some showing loyalty and placing that above the wish to continue with the event. KM has shown loyalty to her staff. Ian has shown loyalty to his long time collaborator, Jean.
We live in interesting times. It is what it is. As above I make no judgement call about the rights and wrongs. All I can say as a volunteer in the past is that you take the rough with the smooth. One has the priviledge of meeting other fans and people at the club as well as playing a part. One also has the frustration when agendas do not dovetail and compromises or cancellations occur. That is par for the course in voluntary activity.
Sometimes you hit gold and find resonance, but at others one is tempted to breach confidences or disrespect others by email or social media. The challenge for all of us is to come through this era with the club and fanbase in one piece.
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johnnyh2
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Post by johnnyh2 on Mar 13, 2017 7:23:33 GMT
Any chance someone can show me the thread with the full email, as at presant I have only read the edited one
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2017 8:08:17 GMT
Can we also be clear before headlines elsewhere become 'misleading', the Club have not cancelled this event - IW and JH have.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:13:45 GMT
Any chance someone can show me the thread with the full email, as at presant I have only read the edited one You'll have to ask the club mate, the full email wasn't on here just the truth of why she got banned from organising it which has now been put up in other places with the usual 'the club are in the wrong' spin that wasn't included in the one on here. Opportunity for the club to take the event on full time now given the childish decision by those that have cancelled. I hope the evening goes ahead and now becomes a club run function in the future.
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Post by overthetop on Mar 13, 2017 8:15:34 GMT
Can we also be clear before headlines elsewhere become 'misleading', the Club have not cancelled this event - IW and JH have. Can we also be clear that the only reason they have cancelled the event is that the club have banned one of the event organisers and current fan of the year from being involved in any kind of Club liaison, because she suggested that some Club employees couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery. Several events and calamitous decisions in the past three years would fully support that assumption.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:17:42 GMT
Fan of the year my fucking arse, there wasn't even a vote fella, the organiser decided there should be a new award for Lifetime achievement and went out and bought a trophy with her name on it, it wasn't won, there wasn't a vote because if there had of been Seb Lewis would have won it hands down .
I suggest you get your facts right before coming out in support of a vociferous protester who has been shouting her mouth off about the regime for months and isn't intelligent enough to use outlook properly so talking of couldn't run a piss up in a brewery is quite apt in this case.
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Post by overthetop on Mar 13, 2017 8:18:37 GMT
Any chance someone can show me the thread with the full email, as at presant I have only read the edited one You'll have to ask the club mate, the full email wasn't on here just the truth of why she got banned from organising it which has now been put up in other places with the usual 'the club are in the wrong' spin that wasn't included in the one on here. Opportunity for the club to take the event on full time now given the childish decision by those that have cancelled. I hope the evening goes ahead and now becomes a club run function in the future. But she wasn't banned from organising it - just banned from liaising with anyone from the Club. Probably on the instructions from pitch PR so they can tell the World she wasn't banned from the event.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:22:58 GMT
By the way a member of both forums has been working on her posts going back three months on CL and I have them all to hand should the person concerned want to continue pleading her innocence.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:25:10 GMT
You'll have to ask the club mate, the full email wasn't on here just the truth of why she got banned from organising it which has now been put up in other places with the usual 'the club are in the wrong' spin that wasn't included in the one on here. Opportunity for the club to take the event on full time now given the childish decision by those that have cancelled. I hope the evening goes ahead and now becomes a club run function in the future. But she wasn't banned from organising it - just banned from liaising with anyone from the Club. Probably on the instructions from pitch PR so they can tell the World she wasn't banned from the event. Which is quite right, after all why would she want to liaise with anybody at the club given that she thinks they couldn't run a piss up in a brewery? Her little click with certain figures inside the club went the day her hero Chris Powell got the bullet.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2017 8:28:34 GMT
You'll have to ask the club mate, the full email wasn't on here just the truth of why she got banned from organising it which has now been put up in other places with the usual 'the club are in the wrong' spin that wasn't included in the one on here. Opportunity for the club to take the event on full time now given the childish decision by those that have cancelled. I hope the evening goes ahead and now becomes a club run function in the future. But she wasn't banned from organising it - just banned from liaising with anyone from the Club. Probably on the instructions from pitch PR so they can tell the World she wasn't banned from the event. Because the staff she had insulted wanted nothing more to do with her and the CEO has a legal duty of care to her staff to protect them from disrespectful 'customers'. The final nail in her coffin was probably when she urged the protestors in Belgium (of whom she was one?) to "test" the owner's "dickey-ticker". If you make such reckless comments you have to accpept there will be consequences.No good whinnying afterwards that it was "only a joke".
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:32:28 GMT
Suggesting that the 200 protesters give RD a heart attack what is a despicable comment in my book and should be investigated by the powers that be.
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Post by webbo on Mar 13, 2017 8:47:18 GMT
Perhaps the newly constituted formal democratic fans group could assist the club in organising a player of the year event for next month.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 8:54:15 GMT
Perhaps, why don't you suggest it to both parties?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 13, 2017 8:56:07 GMT
Patience. It's not constituted yet, webbo, so not an option. But all in the fullness of time. I'm sure the new fans council will be fully involved in next season's event.
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Post by webbo on Mar 13, 2017 9:08:22 GMT
The new fans council. How will it be constituted?
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 9:21:17 GMT
Wrong thread pal.
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