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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2014 8:45:03 GMT
Christ, this Club really is getting itself in a mess now. We will be trawling the Moldovan leagues next. I've stayed out of this for a while, but mate, you are getting very very boring now. Would you rather we sign players from the Ryman League ? At least we have an owner who appears to have ambition for the club, cant wait till he gets shot of Dicky, then the slate will be really clean ! I would rather we signed home grown players from the Championship, or promising tyros like the lad Garner at Preston. Why be abusive, or mention the Rymans League. We don't all have to agree, do we ?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2014 15:24:38 GMT
abusive ! lol , you need to get out more, btw,, did you see the "home grown" players in the world cup ? english football has gone mate, where are we in the world rankings ?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2014 15:46:31 GMT
Royston - I rarely post on here. In my dotage I find it all a bit too strident but I will make one effort to try to reconcile your conscientious objection to the current regime in SE7. You argue you do want an intelligent debate.
You do not want a Belgian owner. That ship has sailed. As far as I am aware the only parties “keen” on buying the club were “overseas” owners from the USA, Eastern Europe, and the Middle East. The last British “investor” withdrew his support. All previous British investors ran out of money. You want a balance of overseas players. Out of the last circa 200 contracted players 25% were overseas, 2005/6 – 40% squad were overseas – 2006/7 – 46% were overseas. Depending on squad size the club can bring in another 3 overseas players and it will still be within those parameters.
Look around you will see the football world has changed. Gone are the days when the likes of Newcastle could go whistle down the local coal mine and bring up 3 international players, offer them a shilling a game, their bus fare and a fish supper win bonus.
Look around you Millwall are owned by an American, Bournemouth are backed by a Russian, I have lost track of who owns Reading or Birmingham, look at Blackburn or Sheffield Wednesday and their Azerbaijani “investor” who is playing silly buggers with RC Lens. I could go on, and on, and on...
Look around you and you will see the predominate mediocrity that has been English football for 3 decades. Look around you and you will see the best players in England stumbling through a world cup looking befuddled and bemused as to how to change a game to win.
Look around you and you will see an insular football culture employing vastly less numbers of qualified football coaches per number of players than all of the major footballing nations. We won the world cup in 1966 through innovation and intelligence. Today the innovation sits in Germany, Holland, Spain, and yes Belgium while the emerging nations across the world are overtaking us. Look around you and you would have seen the USA played a fast moving, dynamic and intelligent game.
The last English manager to win a recognized international senior trophy was Joe Fagan.
Today we have talented lads who have been professionally coached since the age of 8 who a decade later struggle to step up to “mens”“football because UK football destroyed a crucial stepping stone of competitive “mens” reserve football, where young players learn to compete at a senior level with no pressure from intolerant crowds and the burden of securing points to ease clubs financial burden.
Why do we bring in overseas players? Most have developed playing at a senior level in Europe. After 3 decades the FA comes out with feeble proposals for a “B” team initiative. The first influx of overseas players arose because they were simply better than the players in the UK. The 2nd tranche are either better than or as good as their UK counterparts but offer better value for money in terms of transfer or signing on fees and wages. None of that has anything to do with a Belgian electronics company owner.
The club before the takeover was £32mn in debt and losing £5mn p.a. – something had to be done for the club to even exist in the future. It will not happen overnight – it will take time for younger players to develop but in the interim I really could care less whether a player arrives from Bognor, Brussels or Buenos Aires. If he pulls on the shirt he has my support.
The game of football I, and I suspect you, grew up watching started to disappear the moment the football authorities allowed the Premier League to rule. It is not the same but it is the nearest we are going to get. The club either has to get with the program or die. This is not about the next 12 or 24 months this is about the next 5 to 10 years.
I respect none of that maybe for you - but I would really appreciate you not reminding us of that fact each and every day and each and every post.
Thank you
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Post by yorkshireaddick on Jul 17, 2014 16:30:58 GMT
Royston - I rarely post on here. In my dotage I find it all a bit too strident but I will make one effort to try to reconcile your conscientious objection to the current regime in SE7. You argue you do want an intelligent debate. You do not want a Belgian owner. That ship has sailed. As far as I am aware the only parties “keen” on buying the club were “overseas” owners from the USA, Eastern Europe, and the Middle East. The last British “investor” withdrew his support. All previous British investors ran out of money. You want a balance of overseas players. Out of the last circa 200 contracted players 25% were overseas, 2005/6 – 40% squad were overseas – 2006/7 – 46% were overseas. Depending on squad size the club can bring in another 3 overseas players and it will still be within those parameters. Look around you will see the football world has changed. Gone are the days when the likes of Newcastle could go whistle down the local coal mine and bring up 3 international players, offer them a shilling a game, their bus fare and a fish supper win bonus. Look around you Millwall are owned by an American, Bournemouth are backed by a Russian, I have lost track of who owns Reading or Birmingham, look at Blackburn or Sheffield Wednesday and their Azerbaijani “investor” who is playing silly buggers with RC Lens. I could go on, and on, and on... Look around you and you will see the predominate mediocrity that has been English football for 3 decades. Look around you and you will see the best players in England stumbling through a world cup looking befuddled and bemused as to how to change a game to win. Look around you and you will see an insular football culture employing vastly less numbers of qualified football coaches per number of players than all of the major footballing nations. We won the world cup in 1966 through innovation and intelligence. Today the innovation sits in Germany, Holland, Spain, and yes Belgium while the emerging nations across the world are overtaking us. Look around you and you would have seen the USA played a fast moving, dynamic and intelligent game. The last English manager to win a recognized international senior trophy was Joe Fagan. Today we have talented lads who have been professionally coached since the age of 8 who a decade later struggle to step up to “mens”“football because UK football destroyed a crucial stepping stone of competitive “mens” reserve football, where young players learn to compete at a senior level with no pressure from intolerant crowds and the burden of securing points to ease clubs financial burden. Why do we bring in overseas players? Most have developed playing at a senior level in Europe. After 3 decades the FA comes out with feeble proposals for a “B” team initiative. The first influx of overseas players arose because they were simply better than the players in the UK. The 2nd tranche are either better than or as good as their UK counterparts but offer better value for money in terms of transfer or signing on fees and wages. None of that has anything to do with a Belgian electronics company owner. The club before the takeover was £32mn in debt and losing £5mn p.a. – something had to be done for the club to even exist in the future. It will not happen overnight – it will take time for younger players to develop but in the interim I really could care less whether a player arrives from Bognor, Brussels or Buenos Aires. If he pulls on the shirt he has my support. The game of football I, and I suspect you, grew up watching started to disappear the moment the football authorities allowed the Premier League to rule. It is not the same but it is the nearest we are going to get. The club either has to get with the program or die. This is not about the next 12 or 24 months this is about the next 5 to 10 years. I respect none of that maybe for you - but I would really appreciate you not reminding us of that fact each and every day and each and every post. Thank you Very well put. You have mail from me Richard check your inbox.
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Post by Reamsisgod on Jul 17, 2014 17:12:36 GMT
Royston - I rarely post on here. In my dotage I find it all a bit too strident but I will make one effort to try to reconcile your conscientious objection to the current regime in SE7. You argue you do want an intelligent debate. You do not want a Belgian owner. That ship has sailed. As far as I am aware the only parties “keen” on buying the club were “overseas” owners from the USA, Eastern Europe, and the Middle East. The last British “investor” withdrew his support. All previous British investors ran out of money. You want a balance of overseas players. Out of the last circa 200 contracted players 25% were overseas, 2005/6 – 40% squad were overseas – 2006/7 – 46% were overseas. Depending on squad size the club can bring in another 3 overseas players and it will still be within those parameters. Look around you will see the football world has changed. Gone are the days when the likes of Newcastle could go whistle down the local coal mine and bring up 3 international players, offer them a shilling a game, their bus fare and a fish supper win bonus. Look around you Millwall are owned by an American, Bournemouth are backed by a Russian, I have lost track of who owns Reading or Birmingham, look at Blackburn or Sheffield Wednesday and their Azerbaijani “investor” who is playing silly buggers with RC Lens. I could go on, and on, and on... Look around you and you will see the predominate mediocrity that has been English football for 3 decades. Look around you and you will see the best players in England stumbling through a world cup looking befuddled and bemused as to how to change a game to win. Look around you and you will see an insular football culture employing vastly less numbers of qualified football coaches per number of players than all of the major footballing nations. We won the world cup in 1966 through innovation and intelligence. Today the innovation sits in Germany, Holland, Spain, and yes Belgium while the emerging nations across the world are overtaking us. Look around you and you would have seen the USA played a fast moving, dynamic and intelligent game. The last English manager to win a recognized international senior trophy was Joe Fagan. Today we have talented lads who have been professionally coached since the age of 8 who a decade later struggle to step up to “mens”“football because UK football destroyed a crucial stepping stone of competitive “mens” reserve football, where young players learn to compete at a senior level with no pressure from intolerant crowds and the burden of securing points to ease clubs financial burden. Why do we bring in overseas players? Most have developed playing at a senior level in Europe. After 3 decades the FA comes out with feeble proposals for a “B” team initiative. The first influx of overseas players arose because they were simply better than the players in the UK. The 2nd tranche are either better than or as good as their UK counterparts but offer better value for money in terms of transfer or signing on fees and wages. None of that has anything to do with a Belgian electronics company owner. The club before the takeover was £32mn in debt and losing £5mn p.a. – something had to be done for the club to even exist in the future. It will not happen overnight – it will take time for younger players to develop but in the interim I really could care less whether a player arrives from Bognor, Brussels or Buenos Aires. If he pulls on the shirt he has my support. The game of football I, and I suspect you, grew up watching started to disappear the moment the football authorities allowed the Premier League to rule. It is not the same but it is the nearest we are going to get. The club either has to get with the program or die. This is not about the next 12 or 24 months this is about the next 5 to 10 years. I respect none of that maybe for you - but I would really appreciate you not reminding us of that fact each and every day and each and every post. Thank you Grapevine you have just won the case for RV English football is in a shit state as you have superbly stated. imho English football would be better off with more English managers and players in all leagues. This is what RV wants for us
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Post by yorkshireaddick on Jul 17, 2014 17:14:54 GMT
Royston - I rarely post on here. In my dotage I find it all a bit too strident but I will make one effort to try to reconcile your conscientious objection to the current regime in SE7. You argue you do want an intelligent debate. You do not want a Belgian owner. That ship has sailed. As far as I am aware the only parties “keen” on buying the club were “overseas” owners from the USA, Eastern Europe, and the Middle East. The last British “investor” withdrew his support. All previous British investors ran out of money. You want a balance of overseas players. Out of the last circa 200 contracted players 25% were overseas, 2005/6 – 40% squad were overseas – 2006/7 – 46% were overseas. Depending on squad size the club can bring in another 3 overseas players and it will still be within those parameters. Look around you will see the football world has changed. Gone are the days when the likes of Newcastle could go whistle down the local coal mine and bring up 3 international players, offer them a shilling a game, their bus fare and a fish supper win bonus. Look around you Millwall are owned by an American, Bournemouth are backed by a Russian, I have lost track of who owns Reading or Birmingham, look at Blackburn or Sheffield Wednesday and their Azerbaijani “investor” who is playing silly buggers with RC Lens. I could go on, and on, and on... Look around you and you will see the predominate mediocrity that has been English football for 3 decades. Look around you and you will see the best players in England stumbling through a world cup looking befuddled and bemused as to how to change a game to win. Look around you and you will see an insular football culture employing vastly less numbers of qualified football coaches per number of players than all of the major footballing nations. We won the world cup in 1966 through innovation and intelligence. Today the innovation sits in Germany, Holland, Spain, and yes Belgium while the emerging nations across the world are overtaking us. Look around you and you would have seen the USA played a fast moving, dynamic and intelligent game. The last English manager to win a recognized international senior trophy was Joe Fagan. Today we have talented lads who have been professionally coached since the age of 8 who a decade later struggle to step up to “mens”“football because UK football destroyed a crucial stepping stone of competitive “mens” reserve football, where young players learn to compete at a senior level with no pressure from intolerant crowds and the burden of securing points to ease clubs financial burden. Why do we bring in overseas players? Most have developed playing at a senior level in Europe. After 3 decades the FA comes out with feeble proposals for a “B” team initiative. The first influx of overseas players arose because they were simply better than the players in the UK. The 2nd tranche are either better than or as good as their UK counterparts but offer better value for money in terms of transfer or signing on fees and wages. None of that has anything to do with a Belgian electronics company owner. The club before the takeover was £32mn in debt and losing £5mn p.a. – something had to be done for the club to even exist in the future. It will not happen overnight – it will take time for younger players to develop but in the interim I really could care less whether a player arrives from Bognor, Brussels or Buenos Aires. If he pulls on the shirt he has my support. The game of football I, and I suspect you, grew up watching started to disappear the moment the football authorities allowed the Premier League to rule. It is not the same but it is the nearest we are going to get. The club either has to get with the program or die. This is not about the next 12 or 24 months this is about the next 5 to 10 years. I respect none of that maybe for you - but I would really appreciate you not reminding us of that fact each and every day and each and every post. Thank you Grapevine you have just won the case for RV English football is in a shit state as you have superbly stated. imho English football would be better off with more English managers and players in all leagues. This is what RV wants for us Thing is the majority of English managers are not good enough, and a lot are dinosaurs who refuse to evolve with the rest of the footballing world,think that is the point trying to be made,how many English managers are trying new things or developing the game?
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Post by Reamsisgod on Jul 17, 2014 17:43:29 GMT
Grapevine you have just won the case for RV English football is in a shit state as you have superbly stated. imho English football would be better off with more English managers and players in all leagues. This is what RV wants for us Thing is the majority of English managers are not good enough, and a lot are dinosaurs who refuse to evolve with the rest of the footballing world,think that is the point trying to be made,how many English managers are trying new things or developing the game? Yorkshire football is following the rest of the workplace and importing sub standard players because they are cheaper in the long term this will have a massive impact on English football. Look at the NHS or Construction filled with Europeans and Africans, we don't have the skills anymore no why we did away with apprentices and brought in cheap labour. The only way to reverse this is by coming out of Europe and allowing those with the necessary skills to apply for work permits. English players looking to go into management should have the incentive by knowing that there is a good possibility of getting a job in the same way as the academy players
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Post by yorkshireaddick on Jul 17, 2014 17:57:13 GMT
Thing is the majority of English managers are not good enough, and a lot are dinosaurs who refuse to evolve with the rest of the footballing world,think that is the point trying to be made,how many English managers are trying new things or developing the game? Yorkshire football is following the rest of the workplace and importing sub standard players because they are cheaper in the long term this will have a massive impact on English football. Look at the NHS or Construction filled with Europeans and Africans, we don't have the skills anymore no why we did away with apprentices and brought in cheap labour. The only way to reverse this is by coming out of Europe and allowing those with the necessary skills to apply for work permits. English players looking to go into management should have the incentive by knowing that there is a good possibility of getting a job in the same way as the academy players I agree Vince,it's a shame it has come to this on and off the field in our country.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 12:28:56 GMT
So much negative crap on here from people that may believe they understand football but definitely have no grasp of business. Can I just put an end to this anti RD anti Europe bullshit. 1- Charlton is a business as are all other football teams. So they must look for value for money and to be profitable, this is VITAL to the long term security of our club. 2- English players are over priced compared to foreign players. 3- on the basis of our World Cup performance english players are also worse than foreign players. So why would we pay a 200% premium for a worse player??? Are you mad? We have a great academy, which is the whole reason RD bought Charlton, so home grown talent is his bred and butter. 4- our squad is the best it has been for 6 years or more so why be so down? 5- 24 months ago we were nearly bankrupt, RD saved our club. 6- RDs decision to remove Powell saved us from the abyss. 7- on holiday in Tenerife I saw a guy in a Charlton shirt and went to talk to him, but he wasnt English. He was Belgian. With RD we now have an international presence, this is how clubs become big clubs.
Trust me when I say I was a sceptic myself but after looking at the guy more carefully I know RD is taking us where we belong. Back to the promise land.
If you don't like Charlton being safe and secure financially. And with the ability to field top quality international players then quite frankly you are a fool.
Rant over.
In RD we trust.
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Post by reamsofverse on Jul 18, 2014 13:03:51 GMT
Don't worry Bromleyaddick, Royston's departed!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 14:19:34 GMT
Thanks mate. We just need a bit more positivity on this board and in the stands! We have really moved forward I feel since RD took over we need to embrace it and start enjoying our team again rather than creating a negative environment for everyone.
We are not MK Dons we haven't lost our identity. Do you hear Man City fans or Chelsea fans complaining about their success?
Move with the times guys. I for one look forward to success. And in the very near future the premiership.
We are still Charlton. Valley Floyd Road. Just with the backing our great club has deserved for 30 years. COYR
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Post by scabbyhorse on Jul 18, 2014 16:19:25 GMT
Did Royston resign because he had no answer to grapevines post? Will he be back? Will he change his name again? Will he turn up on the Blackpool forum with Ackers? Find out in the next episode of The forum.
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Post by reamsofverse on Jul 18, 2014 16:48:35 GMT
If he does come back under cover I'll know straight away.
As for the strikers I would flog Reza and bring in somebody more consistent.
Offer him to Genk for Jelle Vossen.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 18:07:46 GMT
Don't worry Bromleyaddick, Royston's departed! That is a big pity. He always brought a positive unprejudiced attitude to posting about all things Charlton. I will miss him on here.
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Post by jonkool on Jul 18, 2014 18:12:09 GMT
Not a bloke you'd want to go out for a drink with if you were having tough times in life - you would top yourself after the 2nd pint
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 18:35:33 GMT
Not a bloke you'd want to go out for a drink with if you were having tough times in life - you would top yourself after the 2nd pint I'd have drowned myself in the first one.
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Post by jonkool on Jul 18, 2014 21:46:25 GMT
Not wrong there LB
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Post by Deleted on Jul 18, 2014 22:02:21 GMT
So much negative crap on here from people that may believe they understand football but definitely have no grasp of business. Can I just put an end to this anti RD anti Europe bullshit. 1- Charlton is a business as are all other football teams. So they must look for value for money and to be profitable, this is VITAL to the long term security of our club. 2- English players are over priced compared to foreign players. 3- on the basis of our World Cup performance english players are also worse than foreign players. So why would we pay a 200% premium for a worse player??? Are you mad? We have a great academy, which is the whole reason RD bought Charlton, so home grown talent is his bred and butter. 4- our squad is the best it has been for 6 years or more so why be so down? 5- 24 months ago we were nearly bankrupt, RD saved our club. 6- RDs decision to remove Powell saved us from the abyss. 7- on holiday in Tenerife I saw a guy in a Charlton shirt and went to talk to him, but he wasnt English. He was Belgian. With RD we now have an international presence, this is how clubs become big clubs. Trust me when I say I was a sceptic myself but after looking at the guy more carefully I know RD is taking us where we belong. Back to the promise land. If you don't like Charlton being safe and secure financially. And with the ability to field top quality international players then quite frankly you are a fool. Rant over. In RD we trust. Very fair post but cannot agree with number 4. Not sure how you can compare with our team from 2007/08(even allowing for how poor it was) to today's, even though you may have seen 315 minutes of it.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2014 14:26:55 GMT
That's 7 years isn't it? My maths ain't great so I may stand corrected.
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Post by bigandy99 on Jul 19, 2014 18:25:10 GMT
Let's hope the strikers perform tonight - gotta get in the habit of scoring
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Post by bigandy99 on Jul 26, 2014 18:52:34 GMT
GET YOUR CHEQUE BOOK OUT PLEASES MR DUCHATELET
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2014 8:13:35 GMT
Billy Sharp on loan please.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2014 8:55:45 GMT
That's 7 years isn't it? My maths ain't great so I may stand corrected. I could help you with your maths in the Swan n Mitre
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2014 8:56:16 GMT
Billy Sharp on loan please. Robert Earnshaw for me
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Post by reamsofverse on Jul 27, 2014 9:32:17 GMT
Loan route for me and Bamford or Joe Mason fit the bill, maybe even Will Keane from Man Utd or Mason's out of favour Cardiff team mate Kenwynne Jones. Whoever it is we need one more in, even more so after reading this accurate but depressing article. efootballnet.blogspot.co.uk/2014/07/charlton-need-goals.html
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Post by bexleyboy on Jul 27, 2014 10:24:12 GMT
That was last year .... Thing is the problem at Charlton as never been the strikers it's the service that was provided for them ..... This year the mid looks stronger and with at least one more winger and striker to arrive in this window I think we look strong
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Post by reamsofverse on Jul 27, 2014 11:12:49 GMT
That all depends on one thing Bexleyboy....Yoni Buyens. If he can be the player for us that he was for Standard then he will make us tick, if he isn't then we are back to square one. We need a player in the middle of the park who pulls all the strings, I know it's a different sport but I feel that we are missing a quarterback type player. That position is pivotal in American football as are the qualities of the player who plays there and for me we are missing him.
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Post by canterburyaddick on Jul 27, 2014 12:24:48 GMT
Apart from a brief stint from Shelvey before he went, we haven't had someone in that role since Andy Reid.
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Post by Reamsisgod on Jul 27, 2014 17:04:55 GMT
Apart from a brief stint from Shelvey before he went, we haven't had someone in that role since Andy Reid. Rubbish Shelvey was shit could not make a pass get real
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2014 13:58:37 GMT
That's 7 years isn't it? My maths ain't great so I may stand corrected. I could help you with your maths in the Swan n Mitre I try not to go there too much... Its not particularly accommodating.
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