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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2016 19:36:56 GMT
Bauer not good enough you clearly not seen him future captain , and Sarr will come good needs 12 months to settle in only young in a strange country give the kid a break I know it might have escaped your attention bexleyboy but the team are in a certain amount of difficulty at the moment. We can't really afford the luxury of letting young Naby have 12 months to settle in, bless him.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2016 19:40:11 GMT
Bauer not good enough you clearly not seen him future captain , and Sarr will come good needs 12 months to settle in only young in a strange country give the kid a break all joking aside, do you do a lot of drugs ?
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Post by ExeterAddick on Jan 18, 2016 21:18:01 GMT
Bauer on his day is good enough, as is Diarra sometimes. Naby Sarr is utterly dreadful.
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Post by reamsofverse on Jan 18, 2016 21:38:54 GMT
Bauer on his day is good enough, as is Diarra sometimes. Naby Sarr is utterly dreadful. Maybe so but the on his day is not good enough mate, you need consistency at this level.
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Post by reamsofverse on Jan 18, 2016 21:40:03 GMT
Bauer not good enough you clearly not seen him future captain , and Sarr will come good needs 12 months to settle in only young in a strange country give the kid a break Sporting Lisbon fans said the same, a year later they were laughing at us for paying what we did for him.
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Post by canterburyaddick on Jan 18, 2016 22:36:08 GMT
Bauer is OK, you just need to see that our dip in form exactly coincides with his dismissal at Brighton and KF's inability to deal with our centre back problem since then. Sarr is a constant mistake waiting to happen.
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Post by reamsofverse on Feb 1, 2017 10:59:10 GMT
Revisiting this thread to see if there is any trend to what RD did at Standard Liege three years ago compared to players leaving us. It is absolutely crystal clear to me that RD did weaken the Belgians by not replacing the quality players he sold with players that would maintain their position as regular top three finishers. In his defence though they had just won the Belgian title so that was his ambition achieved, it was time to sell and he cashed in, why shouldn't he? Why should he sell the club and walk away for new owners to come in and try and replicate his achievement with the players HE paid for? So as we all know he sold players for €20m+ and walked, it was somebody else's turn to give it a go, however since then SL have finished 4th, 7th and currently languish just below half way in the table this season despite having new owners and investment. They sold Adrien Trebel last week to bitter rivals Anderlecht for €5m and replaced him with Răzvan Gabriel from Romanian club Viitorul for €2.4m, the only other incoming players have been loans. Standard Liege without Roland Duchatelet are not the same club, they are also ran's not championship of Champions League contenders anymore, his STVV sit just seven points behind them which may seem a lot but back in Roland's days at De Sclessin, Standard and STVV were not even in the same division!! He made Standard what they were, he is having an impact at STVV without spending any money and at Charlton he has appointed a manager who is the sole reason why Watt wanted to come back, JFC wanted to come and play for and clearly the same can be said for Byrne and Page. It's sad and very annoying that we have a small minority of fans who only see the black and white, they are protesters no matter what we do, if we won the league this season they would be slagging the owner and manager off because we didn't win it with a points record! These people think RD is asset stripping, how was Morgan Fox an asset when the lad got despicably booed by the fans home and away? How is Ajose an asset when he has looked totally disinterested? Lookman was an asset but how can you stop kids his age wanting away to realise their dream? They are already predicting Aribo will be flogged next, a player that nobody spoke about until KR gave him his chance! Anyway back to my point here is the proof that RD asset stripped SL and replaced some fantastic players with names that were unheard of before he sold up. uk.soccerway.com/teams/belgium/standard-de-liege/230/transfers/At Charlton meanwhile, we have the opposite, Lookman apart obviously I would say the players that have left have been replaced by better footballers under Robinson.
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Post by Mundell on Feb 1, 2017 19:35:55 GMT
Superb post in my view.
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Post by jonkool on Feb 1, 2017 20:18:05 GMT
Oops the anti regime clan ain't going to like that but it's nigh on impossible to deny the facts and logic of Reams's opinions.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2017 20:32:48 GMT
That is a Superb post Paul
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2017 20:53:54 GMT
Thanks for that post Reams.. I have been impressed with the young players that we have brought in. I don't think any of those would have joined if it wasn't for Karl Robinson. I was also relieved at the end of the window, that we still had Ezri Konsa and Joe Aribo...also in my opinion Page could be a good find also.was very unlucky to get injured in his first game, that I thought he had started very well. Saturday, had he not made a challenge, I've no doubt he would have been labelled a bottle job, by a certain few..
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2017 21:05:22 GMT
Wow, reams. I see you posted that ten hours ago and to my shame, I've only just caught up with it. Terrific analysis - and coming the day after a pathetically underwhelming part three of 'Getting To Know The Network' ,it really puts M Duchtalaet's achievements in a different light. Can I suggest you offer it to Everitt as an article for the next VOTV?
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Post by reamsofverse on Feb 1, 2017 21:18:02 GMT
Wow, reams. I see you posted that ten hours ago and to my shame, I've only just caught up with it. Terrific analysis - and coming the day after a pathetically underwhelming part three of 'Getting To Know The Network' ,it really puts M Duchtalaet's achievements in a different light. Can I suggest you offer it to Everitt as an article for the next VOTV? I'm not having things like that in his comic thank you very much!! By the way these are Roland's incoming players at STVV this season, six loans and minimal fee's paid for four other players, almost identical to us and both teams are on the up? What is there not to like? 30/06/17 Novothny - DVTK N/A 05/01/17 Vetokele - Charlton Loan 04/01/17 Mbombo - Club Brugge Loan 04/01/17 Mechele - Club Brugge Loan 04/01/17 Bruzzese - Club Brugge Loan 30/08/16 Bourard - Anderlecht N/A 30/08/16 Cuevas - Chelsea Loan 16/08/16 Bamba - Saint-Étienne Loan 10/08/16 Zsótér - Videoton N/A 03/08/16 Koubemba - Lille N/A 30/07/16 Ceballos - Charlton Loan
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Post by zenga on Feb 2, 2017 2:33:05 GMT
It is absolutely crystal clear to me that RD did weaken the Belgians by not replacing the quality players he sold with players that would maintain their position as regular top three finishers. Under RD Standard finished 5th, 4th and 2nd (they won the cup that season). So I'd argue that there wasn't a top 3 position to maintain to begin with. In his defence though they had just won the Belgian title so that was his ambition achieved, it was time to sell and he cashed in, why shouldn't he? Why should he sell the club and walk away for new owners to come in and try and replicate his achievement with the players HE paid for? Standard never won the title under RD. So as we all know he sold players for €20m+ and walked He sold his Standard shares in June 2015. According to your soccerway.com link Standard didn't really got any money in the first 6 months of 2015 till he sold his shares. The contrary, they signed Scholz in January that year who was set to join Anderlecht on a 2.5m fee. If you are talking about the summer of 2014, with Batshuayi, Ezekiel and Vainqueur: then I would qualify that as just a normal thing what happens to every top club in Belgium every other year. It was impossible to stop Batshuayi from leaving (kinda same with Lookman and Charlton), and the other 2 were not really top players. however since then SL have finished 4th, 7th and currently languish just below half way in the table this season despite having new owners and investment. So basically it's 4th and 7th + cup for current regime vs RD his first 2 seasons 4th and 5th. 3rd season is a win for RD the way it currently looks like (standard is pretty much done for this season). Which "might" also show that RD has an impact in the long run. They sold Adrien Trebel last week to bitter rivals Anderlecht for €5m and replaced him with Răzvan Gabriel from Romanian club Viitorul for €2.4m, the only other incoming players have been loans. A player (captain) that made himself impossible in the weeks/months before at Standard. Honestly every Belgian club would have done the same (think Steven Defour at the start of the season at Anderlecht, captain but the fans did no longer respect him, he gave a couple of spicy interviews and the only real solution was to sell him to Burnley). Then again, 2.4m is still a big deal for most Belgian clubs. That is considered a big transfer. And every Belgian club has to do the same: buy a player, hope he shines and then sell him for more. Standard Liege without Roland Duchatelet are not the same club, they are also ran's not championship of Champions League contenders anymore,... ... He made Standard what they were, Standard has not been a regular contender for a CL spot for the past ~8 years bar 1 season where they were really good (2013/14) and ended 2nd, and 1 season that was fluke (2010/11). The 2 years before (07/08 and 08/09) that they won the title 2x in a row thanks to an incredible generation. Since then #: 8, 2, 5, 4, 2, 4, 7. Saying that RD made standard into what they were is just ... let's keep it at incorrect. My take on it: RD had a pretty neutral effect on Standard and did not really strip Standard before he left.
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Post by reamsofverse on Feb 2, 2017 8:47:49 GMT
Zenga thanks for pointing that out, I was basing Standard's final finishing positions on the league table at the end of the season but I forget about the stupid play-off system that you have over there .
They did win the title in 2013-14 then totally blew it in 2015 after finishing top after the 30 games played, allowing Anderlecht to catch them in the play-offs.
Over here if we finished 5th this season and lost in the play-off final we would go down as finishing 5th so I was basing it on that fact.
It's because of your play-offs that 8 teams are a CL contender year in year out so not sure how you can say SL were not?
My overall assessment is correct, Standard Liege were a better and more successful club under RD than they have been under any other owner.
Standard were bought by Duchatelet on 23 June 2011 so does that not mean that they won the Belgian title under is ownership in 2013-14?
The €20m Standard got for Batshuayi, Ezekiel and Vainqueur happened while RD still owned the club or had the majority number of shares at least?
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Post by zenga on Feb 2, 2017 9:52:14 GMT
Zenga thanks for pointing that out, I was basing Standard's final finishing positions on the league table at the end of the season but I forget about the stupid play-off system that you have over there . They did win the title in 2013-14 then totally blew it in 2015 after finishing top after the 30 games played, allowing Anderlecht to catch them in the play-offs. Over here if we finished 5th this season and lost in the play-off final we would go down as finishing 5th so I was basing it on that fact. It's because of your play-offs that 8 teams are a CL contender year in year out so not sure how you can say SL were not? My overall assessment is correct, Standard Liege were a better and more successful club under RD than they have been under any other owner. Standard were bought by Duchatelet on 23 June 2011 so does that not mean that they won the Belgian title under is ownership in 2013-14? The €20m Standard got for Batshuayi, Ezekiel and Vainqueur happened while RD still owned the club or had the majority number of shares at least? Hey Reams, I'm not sure where you get it from that Standard won the league in 2013-2014. The last winners of the league: 2006 RSC Anderlecht 2007 RSC Anderlecht 2008 R. Standard de Liège 2009 R. Standard de Liège 2010 RSC Anderlecht 2011 KRC Genk 2012 RSC Anderlecht 2013 RSC Anderlecht 2014 RSC Anderlecht 2015 KAA Gent 2016 Club Brugge KV Just to make sure: we are talking about men football right? Cause I know the females from Standard win the league quite often Here (Belgium) the play-offs are an extension of the league, your points just get halved at the start of the play-offs. So if you finish the 'first round' as 1st with a 6 points lead, then on day 1 of the play-offs you will have a 3 point lead. And if you then manage to lose the next 10 games, you will end up the season as #5 or #6, the fact that you were #1 after the regular season doesn't mean a thing. You won't qualify for Europe nor will anyone celebrate. It's 30+10 games that matter, not the first 30 games. That being said, the system has changed even more this year, not even going to try to explain it. Either way RD never won the Belgian Title with Standard. Technically speaking I guess you are correct that each season 6 teams are a contender for CL (cause of 6 play offs spots). Since we have only 2 CL spots and since Standard finished out of the top 3 so often (being quite a bit behind it) I think in reality none considered them as a real contender. I mean technically speaking the 3rd in the Tour de France had a shot at the victory, but if he ends 15 minutes behind #1 in reality none would consider him a contender. I'm not the native English speaker, so I'm not trying to argue about semantics, just trying to explain how I interpret it. About Batshuayi, Ezekiel and Vainqueur. Yes, but that was 1 year before he sold his shares, so imo they are not very relevant when it comes down to proving asset stripping, especially since every Belgian team needs to do it every few years (just look at who left Anderlecht during the past 2-3 years). Asset stripping in my opinion would be to sell your top players in the months before you leave the club. RD did the contrary: he spent 2,5m on a new defender (who is still there). Since you were insisting that RD was clearly asset stripping at Standard, I felt that wasn't really correct. You don't spend 2,5m when you are stripping assets. I recall us discussing Standard a while ago in some thread. My argument back then was that the fans made it look far worse than the reality, using examples/stories that could easily be debunked/proven wrong/or were out of context. But now you seem to somewhat glorifying RD his stay at Standard, and I don't think that's true either. Hence why I said that RD's impact on Standard was rather neutral (besides his talent for pissing of the fans). And I'm saying that as someone who has a lot of sympathy for the man and his ideas in general (non football related).
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Post by reamsofverse on Feb 2, 2017 10:00:58 GMT
My referral to asset stripping was not a criticism, I was merely pointing out that this is what he is being accused of here yet in my opinion better players are being brought in so he isn't asset stripping at all. You are 100% correct on the title they won in 2013 it was in fact the Belgian Cup, my mistake.
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Post by ridgeback on Mar 13, 2017 10:59:36 GMT
Standard Liege fans show their feelings as the post-Duchatelet club miss the (serious) playoffs for second successive season.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 12:47:29 GMT
14000 there yesterday which is 7000 down on their average for the season.
Since RD left they have not challenged for anything, league or cup!
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 12:54:01 GMT
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Post by bexleyboy on Mar 13, 2017 20:41:38 GMT
And they protested against RD now look at them without him ... let that be a warning for the other lot who seem to think that all it needs to return to the good times is new owners
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Post by zenga on Mar 13, 2017 21:10:32 GMT
14000 there yesterday which is 7000 down on their average for the season. Since RD left they have not challenged for anything, league or cup! Not trying to be a dick here, but Standard are the current cup holders, they won the cup in 2016.
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 13, 2017 21:17:02 GMT
14000 there yesterday which is 7000 down on their average for the season. Since RD left they have not challenged for anything, league or cup! Not trying to be a dick here, but Standard are the current cup holders, they won the cup in 2016. As you are close to the Jupiler league, can you please explain why Liege are not a top six side? Is it because they have sold quality or failed to find the right players?
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 13, 2017 21:27:48 GMT
It's because of the title of this thread, they sold all their stars and have never recovered under new owners.
Add the emergence of the likes of Ooostende who sold Jordan Lukaku to Lazio and bought in two or three good players with the money, Mechelen and Charleroi who like Oostende sold Kebano and there centre back and rebuilt and that is the reason why. I suppose you could also add that Gent and Genk have concentrated on Europe this season too.
Zenga you are quite right Standard are the Belgian Cup holders, I meant to say challenging for the title and the CL places like they did under Duchatelet.
My mistake thanks for correcting me..
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Post by zenga on Mar 14, 2017 18:32:34 GMT
As you are close to the Jupiler league, can you please explain why Liege are not a top six side? Is it because they have sold quality or failed to find the right players? 1. Drama: Olivier Renard and Daniel Van Buyten ran the club together, Renard with very little and Van Buyten with no experience at all. Renard came over from KV Mechelen during the summer of 2016, where he was the sporting director. As soon as the season began they wanted to get rid of their coach Yannick Ferrera, who won them the cup last year and who is one of the (if not the) coming men among Belgian coaches. It was no secret that Renard and V. Buyten had different ideas about how the club should be ran and the direction to go. But since Ferrera won the cup + had decent initial results (at least decent performances) this season they couldn't fire him without alienating the fans and press (Standard fans are pretty hardcore). Eventually they fired Ferrera and got KV Mechelen their coach, Jankovic (Renard worked with him at KVM). And Ferrera went to KV Mechelen, where he did a remarkable job (he barely missed top 6 and the play offs). A couple of weeks ago Van Buyten decided to quit at Standard (after a heavy interview), so now only Renard is in charge. 2. Transfers: Van Buyten has lots of international contacts, and the owner of Standard is a big fan of the player Van Buyten. Van Buyten and Henrotay (sports agent and former director of Standard) took the owner to all the big clubs, talked about big transfers ... owner was impressed, but blinded at the same time. So a lot of wasted time and missed opportunities there. 3. Transfers part 2: for every Belgian Club it's hit or miss every season. They either buy unknown players or players who had a (few) bad year(s). Some will disagree, but imo it's often more luck than wisdom. My point being: it just happens every few seasons that most players that your recruit don't work out, for a whole set of reasons. But chances are as likely that the next transfer window will workout once again. Conclusion: after RD left a power vacuum emerged, that seems to be settled since last month (there are many different 'camps' behind the scene in Standard). They have everything going now to create stability. If that will happen is a whole other question.
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 5, 2019 18:55:30 GMT
Deja vu anyone!!!
I have never hated a human being the way I hate Roland Duchatelet.
I long for the day that this poisonous, yellow toothed scumbag gets his comeuppance.
He has to be targeted in Belgium in the same way he was by Standard Liege fans.
What they did in his office never hurt them, in fact soon after he fucked off, driven out, they didn't fuck about either I heard, it was a case of, there's the door you cunt, now fuck off.
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Post by revilo on Aug 5, 2019 19:06:50 GMT
Deja vu anyone!!! I have never hated a human being the way I hate Roland Duchatelet. I long for the day that this poisonous, yellow toothed scumbag gets his comeuppance. He has to be targeted in Belgium in the same way he was by Standard Liege fans. What they did in his office never hurt them, in fact soon after he fucked off, driven out, no fucking about either. We'll get there eventually!
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