Why can't we attract good players anymore? What's changed?

[reamsofverse]

Six months ago Jesurun Rak-Sakyi was playing for us, now our loans are made up of basic footballers who have made no difference to us at all.

Surely there are EPL loans out there who could have the effect he had on us?

We are still in the hunt for Aaron Collins but he would be an idiot to turn Bolton down for Charlton Athletic who are going nowhere but backwards.

By the way expect Caleb Taylor to go to Boltn on loan for the rest of the season after the West Brom v Wolves today.

We used to be an attractive club where players wanted to come, full time or on loan. The system is all wrong. The fella doing the hiring of the players is not good enough, he has his own conveyor belt of absolute rubbish. Then there are the people doing the buying. Having money to spend and how you spend it are two different things and once again the budget is being completely mismanaged.

[bigandy99]

There has to be a turning point.. a bottoming out.. are we there yet, I don’t know..stability in the club is a starter and then it’s a good manager who can organise a team.. then you add quality as you go forward..maybe we need a higher profile manager who can lay out a plan…

[massivebeak]

Head case of a club- nobody that has a better option wants to be involved

[revilo]

Hate to say it but maybe Gallen should get more credit for his signings compared to some of the shit we've signed lately.

[aucklandaddick]

Jan 28, 2024 12:21:58 GMT reamsofverse said:

Six months ago Jesurun Rak-Sakyi was playing for us, now our loans are made up of basic footballers who have made no difference to us at all.

Surely there are EPL loandsout there who could have the effect he had on us?

We are stioll in the hunt for Aaron Collins but he would be an idiot to turn Bolton down for Charlton Athletic who are going nowhere but backwards.

By the way expect Caleb Taylor to go to Boltn on loan for the rest of the season after the West Brom v Wolves today.

We used to be an attractive club where players wanted to come, full time or on loan. The system is all wrong. The fella doing the hiring of the players is not good enough, he has his own conveyor belt of absolute rubbish. Then there are the people doing the buying. Having money to spend and how you spend it are two different things and once again the budget is being completely mismanaged.

Agree entirely with this Reams

Surely if you are American owners pumping money in you would as a priority make your recruitment person / team as a very key cog in the machine
At present we are in a relegation battle having had a top six budget, Americans don’t tend to do failure
If I were them I would looking at teams who have got their recruitment right and try to learn from this….and maybe even head hunt these people

[valleyfaithful]

Results drive everything. We've been in free fall for years - if our signings this year had clicked and recruitment had been onpoint, we'd be on top and giving players a dialemma when considering us vs Bolton.

It's the culture of defeat that we've had for multiple seasons given our lack of on-field leadership. For me that starts at the back, AMB has to go for a keeper you feel safe behind you, commanding the defenders and not making rash, flappy attempts at saves. Add to that a confident manager who can get a tune out of his players and you have a good start.

Add 3-4 quality players to our squad and a proper coach like Nathan Jones and I think you'd have a start. Jones at the helm might help attract the Caleb Taylors and Aaron Collins' of the world and before you know it we're winning games, things look alot different then.

[Mundell]

Jan 28, 2024 19:11:24 GMT aucklandaddick said:

Jan 28, 2024 12:21:58 GMT reamsofverse said:

Six months ago Jesurun Rak-Sakyi was playing for us, now our loans are made up of basic footballers who have made no difference to us at all.

Surely there are EPL loandsout there who could have the effect he had on us?

We are stioll in the hunt for Aaron Collins but he would be an idiot to turn Bolton down for Charlton Athletic who are going nowhere but backwards.

By the way expect Caleb Taylor to go to Boltn on loan for the rest of the season after the West Brom v Wolves today.

We used to be an attractive club where players wanted to come, full time or on loan. The system is all wrong. The fella doing the hiring of the players is not good enough, he has his own conveyor belt of absolute rubbish. Then there are the people doing the buying. Having money to spend and how you spend it are two different things and once again the budget is being completely mismanaged.

Agree entirely with this Reams

Surely if you are American owners pumping money in you would as a priority make your recruitment person / team as a very key cog in the machine
At present we are in a relegation battle having had a top six budget, Americans don’t tend to do failure
If I were them I would looking at teams who have got their recruitment right and try to learn from this….and maybe even head hunt these people

I've been positive about the GFP/SE7 takeover for two reasons. First, the investors are serious business people, have deep pockets and are very capable of funding the club's operating losses, even if they may not intend to throw money away. Second, I very much like the fact that they've put in place and/or funded a highly professional and modern management structure, with a football CEO, FD, Technical Director and Director of Performance. The question for me, about which I have always been open-minded while being willing to give the benefit of the doubt (i.e. neither negative nor particularly positive), has been about the competence and ability to execute of that management team. 

My assumption, given that he put the investor consortium together (which means he must have 'sold' them a business case), has been that Charlie Methven put the management team together with little or no input from the investors. And they'll be looking to him, as well as Jim Rodwell and Andy Scott, for an explanation of what's gone wrong.   

However, as you rightly say, the American investors won't tolerate poor performance for long. If they're not convinced by the SMT's narrative then they'll need to decide what to do. I very much doubt they'll want to "lean in" and directly appoint a head of recruitment for example, but in the first instance they may decide to work with a consultant, like Twenty First Group for example, with a brief to assess the current situation and make appropriate recommendations. An organisation like Twenty First Group might also help with recruitment. 

From the investor's perspective its still very early days, but its entirely possible that Rodwell and Scott are vulnerable already. Of course, if Methven senses that the investors are restless, he may decide that his own interests are best served by throwing his colleagues under the bus, just as Scott did with Michael Appleton. We'll see. It will obviously be much less destabilising if Rodwell and Scott can deliver.  

[returnofpiestalker]

Management churn is a large part of it.

Any organisation in any sector that has such a high turnover in such a key position will only attract what can’t be placed elsewhere. We still have a reputation as a basket case of a club.

If I were running things I’d offer a decent prem manager with proven track record a substantial financial stake in the club in return for success / the trappings of getting to the PL promised land again.

[mikebassett]

There’s been four loans from Premier League clubs this season, so I don’t think there’s much in this at all. Granted, not many have worked out here but there’s factors in that, that goes from the top down to the playing squad to the coaching staff.

[divot]

It's a good question;

Perhaps, the bigger clubs have taken a look at recent loans into Charlton and have concluded that their players haven't developed sufficiently (or even gone backwards) and therefore we may have lost a bit of reputation. It won't have gone un-noticed that we had a few unsuccessful loans in January 2023 (Nile John etc) and that the trend has continued this season.

For this to change, we are probably going to have to make some good permanent signings and fewer loan signings. The few we do make, can then come into a stronger set-up and will hopefully develop quicker.

It might also be a question of money. Perhaps other clubs are willing to pay a bigger % of a loan player's wages.

[kings hill addick]

I also think that the loans are all going to be a bit hit and miss. I don't think that the parent clubs, really, know how good their players are when they have just been playing in the youth sides. For example, Had Chelsea known how good Connor Gallagher was we would, probably, not have had him on loan. He would, probably, have ended up at a club challenging at the top of the Championship - which is what happened in the January.

Neither Bielik not Cullen were loaned out to League One sides, again, after their season with us. I suspect that had Arsenal and West Ham been able to demonstrate how good they were they might have ended up at Championship sides in 2018/19.

The reality is that the players we 'borrow' are most likely to be squad players at best because the parent clubs want them to be playing as high as they can to develop them, sure, but to add value to them. The majority of these players are going to be sold on as they won't make it at the club they are currently contracted to. The higher up they can play the more money they can be sold for. Clubs will only loan their players to League One if they can't get them into a Championship club.

This is why, I believe, that the hit rate for loan players is so average, and why when a team in League One sign three (or more) exceptionally (and surprisingly) talented youngsters they can surprise world with an outstanding season. Even going from surviving a relegation battle to making the playoffs can be down to three teenagers that are much better than anyone expected.