Is the Academy contingent in the planned 8-8-8 achievable?

[reamsofverse]

First of all correct me if I have got this wrong but having listened to the SE7 interview the other night, the plan as I understood it was to eventually have a squad of 24 made up of 8 academy players?

If that's exactly what it meant I really don't see how this is achievable given that we have never managed to produce that amount of youngsters all at the same time.

There have been some wonderful players that have come through down the years, Konsa, Shelvey, Parker, Lookman, Aribo, Jenkinson, Gomez, Ajayi and Pope, but they they were spread apart over a number of years and not in the same season or two.

I don't want to have a downer on today's academy prospects but they are just not of the same ilk as those above and I struggle to see how having eight youngsters in a 24 man squad is possible given the standard that we saw from the likes of Tyreece Campbell yesterday.

I would say that as things stand only Kanu and Asiimwe have the potential to improve and be involved in what is going to be a much stronger squad going forward.

[innerspaced]

Anything is achievable, but this 888 is subjective. Everyone will have differing opinions on who is elite or solid etc.
I'm oldskool, you need 11 elite or players available to jump up a division with 11 cover players wether they are academy players or solid divisional performers. Either way it cost money

[seriouslyred]

Yes eight Academy players, eight B listers and eight Elite players. At present we might have eight from the Academy but AMB and Thomas don't count as they're senior professionals. Only players U21 count as they can be excluded from the SCMP calculations.

Every summer we take three or four from the Academy into the senior squad. Perhaps one or two are good enough to start games in August. But it's rare that they become first team regulars in their first season.

For sure, most play a few times then go out on loan to league two or three national league. It's important for their development to get 30 games under their belts ASAP.

Last season our front three consisted Leaburn, Campbell and Rak-Sakyi. All under 20 and none too shabby. Unfortunately this time Leaburn out injured and Campbell just not the same threat.

So yes it's possible to have eight U21 in the squad but some may be better off out on loan getting game time elsewhere. This is nothing new for we've always had a large number of Academy lads in the squad. Great if they can produce stars like the players you mention.

[Mundell]

I think this is an interesting question Paul and, like you, taken literally I think the answer has to be no. However, I don’t think we should take the 8-8-8 strategy too literally. For me it’s a narrative, a way of thinking about how to build and structure the squad and, perhaps, an idealised version of where, on average, SE7 would like to be. Hopefully, the framework will aid decision making while being used pragmatically. 

A quick review of the Salary Sport website suggests that the top players in League One earn £8-10k a week and no more. In other words, you don’t need to pay more than that to sign the best players in League One. The elite players. It’s possible, therefore, to sign eight of these “elite players” at a cost somewhere between £3.3-4.1m. Eight core players might then cost, say £2m. My sense is that the thinking is that this can work, both playing wise and budget wise, if the balance of the squad is then made of academy products who aren’t yet paid as fully developed first team squad members. 

The extent to which this might work is obviously going to vary quite a lot from season to season, depending on the pipeline from the academy, but barring serious injury problems we might not need more than four or five academy players to actually play League football and even these may not need to make more than a handful of appearances. Genuine breakthrough players are then a bonus. 

This season those players would include Leaburn, Kanu, Asiimwe, Anderson, T Campbell and perhaps even Ness. That might be manageable providing those players weren’t needed to play that often and, in turn, they might do better when needed with better players around them. 

I’m sure the plan would be to flex the core group if the academy pipeline appears dry. One of the key challenges for the club then is to judge which young players might be good enough for first team football 6-12 months out. K Anderson is obviously highly regarded (though he hasn’t particularly impressed) and still only 18. I was impressed by Kedwell in an EFL Trophy match earlier this season. Might he make the third ‘8’ next season?

Ironically, right now we seem to have an excess of players in the core group. If Coventry is any indication of what Rodwell meant by elite then there’s a lot of work needed to fill out that part of the squad. 

I think this is going to be interesting. 

[somerton]

It is occasionally but not often. Most years you would think you are doing well if 3 players are introduced during the season to league games. In the higher leagues it is even less likely.

[seriouslyred]

Jan 14, 2024 14:12:23 GMT Mundell said:

I think this is an interesting question Paul and, like you, taken literally I think the answer has to be no. However, I don’t think we should take the 8-8-8 strategy too literally. For me it’s a narrative, a way of thinking about how to build and structure the squad and, perhaps, an idealised version of where, on average, SE7 would like to be. Hopefully, the framework will aid decision making while being used pragmatically. 

A quick review of the Salary Sport website suggests that the top players in League One earn £8-10k a week and no more. In other words, you don’t need to pay more than that to sign the best players in League One. The elite players. It’s possible, therefore, to sign eight of these “elite players” at a cost somewhere between £3.3-4.1m. Eight core players might then cost, say £2m. My sense is that the thinking is that this can work, both playing wise and budget wise, if the balance of the squad is then made of academy products who aren’t yet paid as fully developed first team squad members. 

The extent to which this might work is obviously going to vary quite a lot from season to season, depending on the pipeline from the academy, but barring serious injury problems we might not need more than four or five academy players to actually play League football and even these may not need to make more than a handful of appearances. Genuine breakthrough players are then a bonus. 

This season those players would include Leaburn, Kanu, Asiimwe, Anderson, T Campbell and perhaps even Ness. That might be manageable providing those players weren’t needed to play that often and, in turn, they might do better when needed with better players around them. 

I’m sure the plan would be to flex the core group if the academy pipeline appears dry. One of the key challenges for the club then is to judge which young players might be good enough for first team football 6-12 months out. K Anderson is obviously highly regarded (though he hasn’t particularly impressed) and still only 18. I was impressed by Kedwell in an EFL Trophy match earlier this season. Might he make the third ‘8’ next season?

Ironically, right now we seem to have an excess of players in the core group. If Coventry is any indication of what Rodwell meant by elite then there’s a lot of work needed to fill out that part of the squad. 

I think this is going to be interesting. 

There's a lot of players in the core group but many are loans or out of contract in just five months time. One senses a cull!

One suspects the original strategy was to grow the elite players from the Academy or acquiring 22 year olds from elsewhere.

Instead we are now looking for eight players who will hit the ground running. Ideally we have just landed four.