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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 10, 2024 21:10:42 GMT
I know he's just a kid but I just don't rate him at all. Never have never will. Looked like a little boy lost today.
Anderson is a close second, offers strength and breaks up opponents play but offers nothing going forward.
Back to Tyreece and if he is the stand in if and when one of our lead strikers is injured then there's still time to bring in somebody new because he is not the answer and never will be.
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Post by revilo on Aug 11, 2024 4:38:58 GMT
I know he's just a kid but I just don't rate him at all. Never have never will. Looked like a little boy lost today. Anderson is a close second, offers strength and breaks up opponents play but offers nothing going forward. Bak to Tyreece and if he is the stand in if and when one of our lead strikers is injured then there's still time to bring in somebody new because he is not the answer and never will be. I agree with all of this mate but the question is does NJ also see it? |
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Post by petetongthereturn on Aug 11, 2024 5:25:05 GMT
Hopefully I’m wrong but I can’t see our thousands of strikers and midfielders on the books scoring for fun to get promotion.
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Post by dickybaby on Aug 11, 2024 6:35:33 GMT
I think we need to be patient with TC as he is still very inexperienced and was playing against some big old CBs yesterday. His pace is his biggest asset and the runs he makes into channels ala Pompey - CBs also hate going back towards their goal. It creates space for others. And although he had a quite quiet game he sprung into life for that one chance and nearly scored.
He is also a confidence player so us fans can do him and the club a favour by vocally backing him.
Anderson was good yesterday and cut out his major problem last year which was giving the ball away. Very young still
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Post by aucklandaddick on Aug 11, 2024 6:57:05 GMT
Blimey I could have written this thread myself…I totally agree…..
Don’t want to be piling in on our youngsters as they have really great potential but I have said many times they should be on the fringes of the first eleven eleven and not playing in the team week in week out…
Yesterday was crying out for old experienced heads up top but unfortunately Godden was injured and I posted at half time thst we were literally playing with Adhadme up front on his own…..and you could see the frustration in him as he won flick ons to see no one running on to them
TC has plenty of potential and should be used as an impact sub nothing more
As for Anderson I am sorry but I just don’t get it, I don’t see what he brings to the team, yes he gets around the pitch well and he pressed well but there is no goals in there or assists or even a creative pass….We so lacked that player who can run with the ball and makes things happen further up the pitch
Grapevine used that phrase grown ups when he talked about some of the players we have recruited like Godden and Berry……Yesterday was definitely a day for grown ups on the pitch rather then youngsters IMO
Yesterday was very much like some of the games last season where we just didn’t have control of the middle of the park….Coventry was good at winning the ball further up the park, you could see him looking up trying to play a killer ball which just wasnt there so he played it safe, Docherty didn’t have his best game and we really lacked thst spark in the middle of the park…..The redeeming factor was how well the back five played especially Edward’s and Jones..
Yesterday was a grindathon, not easy to watch, but we nicked the points which he didn’t do much last season so the positive is there…..but it was plain to see what we were missing….
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Post by revilo on Aug 11, 2024 7:49:02 GMT
I think we need to be patient with TC as he is still very inexperienced and was playing against some big old CBs yesterday. His pace is his biggest asset and the runs he makes into channels ala Pompey - CBs also hate going back towards their goal. It creates space for others. And although he had a quite quiet game he sprung into life for that one chance and nearly scored. He is also a confidence player so us fans can do him and the club a favour by vocally backing him. Anderson was good yesterday and cut out his major problem last year which was giving the ball away. Very young still All the more reason for him to not be a starter if he requires experience. Need someone who can already do it and not need to wait for them to mould into that player. No disrespect to TC at all but he's just not that player yet. |
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Post by aucklandaddick on Aug 11, 2024 7:54:45 GMT
I think we need to be patient with TC as he is still very inexperienced and was playing against some big old CBs yesterday. His pace is his biggest asset and the runs he makes into channels ala Pompey - CBs also hate going back towards their goal. It creates space for others. And although he had a quite quiet game he sprung into life for that one chance and nearly scored. He is also a confidence player so us fans can do him and the club a favour by vocally backing him. Anderson was good yesterday and cut out his major problem last year which was giving the ball away. Very young still All the more reason for him to not be a starter if he requires experience. Need someone who can already do it and not need to wait for them to mould into that player. No disrespect to TC at all but he's just not that player yet. This…..👍 |
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Post by seriouslyred on Aug 11, 2024 8:06:07 GMT
We've beaten Portsmouth in a friendly and now Wigan away in the league. Why not give it a few more games before suggesting how the side and squad might be improved?
As it happens we have five talented 19/20 year olds in the Matchday squad. Or we will once Miles Leaburn is fit again. They'll all need coaching and minutes to improve.
Leaburn, Campbell and Rak-Sakyi looked fairly decent in a 4-3-3 back in March 2023. So I'll wait until the squad settles before making a call, especially our midfield.
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Post by grapevine49 on Aug 11, 2024 8:32:58 GMT
I understand and indeed at a broader level share your concerns. Yesterday was Campbells’ first League outing in a striker role. Technically he has long shown good technical skills and very decent pace. Can Campbell Mk ll put it together at this level? He has shown well in preseason contributing to 4 goals. On that basis alone he had earned the shirt.
I suggest it speaks to precisely how Jones will operate. You earn the shirt.
Arguably yesterday none of Ahadme, Campbell, Aneke or Kanu offered more than hard work but then it was in large part classic attritional League 1 fare.
There are indeed those who look at Anderson on the same basis. Berry is a much more accomplished player but Anderson excels at one thing. He IS the press. He may not yet win too many clean tackles, score or even create many goals beyond the pressure his physicality and work rate creates. Jones is using that one borderline battering ram technique to disrupt the opposition to enable him to learn on the job. Believe me you will miss it when it’s not there. Is it pretty? No.
I can but refer back to my level at a County League standard where you invariably across 3 midfield players had one who could pass, one who could tackle and one who could run. You rarely if ever had a player at that level who could excel at more than one element let alone all three.
The broader message is ….sorry it comes with who we have decided to be and in truth many supporters believe we should be. I am not arguing whether it is right or wrong but have added elsewhere a lengthy post on seasons expectations.
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Post by dickybaby on Aug 11, 2024 8:45:11 GMT
I understand and indeed at a broader level share your concerns. Yesterday was Campbells’ first League outing in a striker role. Technically he has long shown good technical skills and very decent pace. Can Campbell Mk ll put it together at this level? He has shown well in preseason contributing to 4 goals. On that basis alone he had earned the shirt. I suggest it speaks to precisely how Jones will operate. You earn the shirt. Arguably yesterday none of Ahadme, Campbell, Aneke or Kanu offered more than hard work but then it was in large part classic attritional League 1 fare. There are indeed those who look at Anderson on the same basis. Berry is a much more accomplished player but Anderson excels at one thing. He IS the press. He may not yet win too many clean tackles, score or even create many goals beyond the pressure his physicality and work rate creates. Jones is using that one borderline battering ram technique to disrupt the opposition to enable him to learn on the job. Believe me you will miss it when it’s not there. Is it pretty? No. I can but refer back to my level at a County League standard where you invariably across 3 midfield players had one who could pass, one who could tackle and one who could run. You rarely if ever had a player at that level who could excel at more than one element let alone all three. The broader message is ….sorry it comes with who we have decided to be and in truth many supporters believe we should be. I am not arguing whether it is right or wrong but have added elsewhere a lengthy post on seasons expectations. Yes good point re the press. Its something we havent had in years and we were good yesterday with TC and Anderson at the fore. Its a critical part of how many teams operate particularly Klopp. Charlton are a good working class club and I dont want pretty thanks very much a battering ram suits me and many fans perfectly  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2024 8:52:24 GMT
To be fair to Campbell and Ahadme both hardly got a decent pass all game. There was too much hoof ball. Campbell has got pace which worries defenders. He is still learning his trade. He has looked good in pre-Season so why not give him a chance? I was there yesterday and it seems that our weakness has become our strength. The defence looked very solid and well drilled. I think Mitchell Jones and Gilesphey are as good as any other three in this division.
But we are lacking flair and until this is addressed we are not going up.
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Post by aucklandaddick on Aug 11, 2024 8:59:35 GMT
To be fair to Campbell and Ahadme both hardly got a decent pass all game. There was too much hoof ball. Campbell has got pace which worries defenders. He is still learning his trade. He has looked good in pre-Season so why not give him a chance? I was there yesterday and it seems that our weakness has become our strength. The defence looked very solid and well drilled. I think Mitchell Jones and Gilesphey are as good as any other three in this division. But we are lacking flair and until this is addressed we are not going up. They look well drilled now the back 3 Dick, rather than the disorganised unit of last season…..Flair is the key word…..We are not going to push for top 6 with a workman like midfield three that we had yesterday….plenty of decent pressing and harrying but sorry but i can see many more grindathons coming and when we go behind you wonder where the reply in goals is going to come from….. Slightly concerning also was the lack of the wingbacks getting over the halfway line….this was supposed to be our main source of creativity….even though both had very good games defensively Great result yesterday, a really professional 3 points but I always look at the bigger picture and we are still lacking in certain areas IMO |
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Post by Mundell on Aug 11, 2024 9:01:32 GMT
I think grapevine49 is on the money. I too am a bit surprised that Campbell is starting, but the key here is not so much the player’s ability in some abstract sense but what it is Jones wants from his players both individually and collectively. Jones obviously sees something in Campbell (as he did in Anderson last season) and for me the big surprise is that he’s gone ahead of Kanu in the high pressing, willing runner role. Does Godden have the energy to play this role or will he be used primarily as a tactical and/or impact sub? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2024 9:08:14 GMT
I think grapevine49 is on the money. I too am a bit surprised that Campbell is starting, but the key here is not so much the player’s ability in some abstract sense but what it is Jones wants from his players both individually and collectively. Jones obviously sees something in Campbell (as he did in Anderson last season) and for me the big surprise is that he’s gone ahead of Kanu in the high pressing, willing runner role. Does Godden have the energy to play this role or will he be used primarily as a tactical and/or impact sub? I am not at all surprised that Campbell is starting. He scored four goals in pre season and looked threatening. I remain to be convinced by Ahadme considering the amount of money we spent on him. I see Godden is injured. With Leaburn coming back and Godden also returning we now have some options. I would give a few of the squad players a runout on Tuesday. |
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Post by aucklandaddick on Aug 11, 2024 9:22:33 GMT
I think grapevine49 is on the money. I too am a bit surprised that Campbell is starting, but the key here is not so much the player’s ability in some abstract sense but what it is Jones wants from his players both individually and collectively. Jones obviously sees something in Campbell (as he did in Anderson last season) and for me the big surprise is that he’s gone ahead of Kanu in the high pressing, willing runner role. Does Godden have the energy to play this role or will he be used primarily as a tactical and/or impact sub? I am not at all surprised that Campbell is starting. He scored four goals in pre season and looked threatening. I remain to be convinced by Ahadme considering the amount of money we spent on him. I see Godden is injured. With Leaburn coming back and Godden also returning we now have some options. I would give a few of the squad players a runout on Tuesday. TBF even previous goal scoring forwards of ours wouldn’t have had much of a sniff yesterday such was the fact that we didn’t actually create many if any goal scoring chances……In Adhadmes defence at least he was showing for the ball and feeding off the poorest of scraps via our often hoof ball football…..We just lacked a bit of nous in the middle of the park…..lots a of talk about our press and closing down which is great but is there not a player out there available that can press just as well as we did yesterday but also produce a bit of creativity…..surely there must be…..🤣 |
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 11, 2024 9:36:26 GMT
I think we need to be patient with TC as he is still very inexperienced and was playing against some big old CBs yesterday. His pace is his biggest asset and the runs he makes into channels ala Pompey - CBs also hate going back towards their goal. It creates space for others. And although he had a quite quiet game he sprung into life for that one chance and nearly scored. He is also a confidence player so us fans can do him and the club a favour by vocally backing him. Anderson was good yesterday and cut out his major problem last year which was giving the ball away. Very young still But that's because he hardly had the ball mate. If he starts then he has to contribute more than one shot and a cross. |
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Post by Mundell on Aug 11, 2024 9:44:04 GMT
I think grapevine49 is on the money. I too am a bit surprised that Campbell is starting, but the key here is not so much the player’s ability in some abstract sense but what it is Jones wants from his players both individually and collectively. Jones obviously sees something in Campbell (as he did in Anderson last season) and for me the big surprise is that he’s gone ahead of Kanu in the high pressing, willing runner role. Does Godden have the energy to play this role or will he be used primarily as a tactical and/or impact sub? I am not at all surprised that Campbell is starting. He scored four goals in pre season and looked threatening. I remain to be convinced by Ahadme considering the amount of money we spent on him. I see Godden is injured. With Leaburn coming back and Godden also returning we now have some options. I would give a few of the squad players a runout on Tuesday. Perhaps I should have made my point slightly differently. Having seen Campbell play against Portsmouth last Saturday, I’d have been very surprised if he hadn’t started yesterday. I should perhaps have said that I’m surprised we’ve found ourselves in a position where he’s starting league games in a two upfront, but I think that’s as much to do with how Jones wants to play as anything else. If Godden doesn’t have Campbell’s legs I’m not sure he’s certain to come in when fit. |
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Post by huddy1978 on Aug 11, 2024 9:57:15 GMT
I think TC is still only a young player with potential, he will suit some games better than others, yesterday just wasn't his game.
I would prefer Kanu up there instead with the option to bring on TC for pace.
And Ahadme wasn't that effective to be fair either.
Still too early though to make major judgments.
Will leave that to the boss.
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Post by discocafc on Aug 11, 2024 10:31:36 GMT
I think it’s harsh on TC based on yesterday’s game. We’ve seen what he is capable of, did well for the goal and the setup last weekend
Think he has potential but I agree with Dicky that I think we need more patience with him.
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Post by aucklandaddick on Aug 11, 2024 11:13:49 GMT
I am not at all surprised that Campbell is starting. He scored four goals in pre season and looked threatening. I remain to be convinced by Ahadme considering the amount of money we spent on him. I see Godden is injured. With Leaburn coming back and Godden also returning we now have some options. I would give a few of the squad players a runout on Tuesday. Perhaps I should have made my point slightly differently. Having seen Campbell play against Portsmouth last Saturday, I’d have been very surprised if he hadn’t started yesterday. I should perhaps have said that I’m surprised we’ve found ourselves in a position where he’s starting league games in a two upfront, but I think that’s as much to do with how Jones wants to play as anything else. If Godden doesn’t have Campbell’s legs I’m not sure he’s certain to come in when fit. I think Godden will be one of the fittest players we have and be easily capable of implementing the press from forward areas…..I think experience up top is going to be key if we play a workman like midfield three every week….. |
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Post by reddan12 on Aug 11, 2024 12:36:20 GMT
I understand and indeed at a broader level share your concerns. Yesterday was Campbells’ first League outing in a striker role. Technically he has long shown good technical skills and very decent pace. Can Campbell Mk ll put it together at this level? He has shown well in preseason contributing to 4 goals. On that basis alone he had earned the shirt. I suggest it speaks to precisely how Jones will operate. You earn the shirt. Arguably yesterday none of Ahadme, Campbell, Aneke or Kanu offered more than hard work but then it was in large part classic attritional League 1 fare. There are indeed those who look at Anderson on the same basis. Berry is a much more accomplished player but Anderson excels at one thing. He IS the press. He may not yet win too many clean tackles, score or even create many goals beyond the pressure his physicality and work rate creates. Jones is using that one borderline battering ram technique to disrupt the opposition to enable him to learn on the job. Believe me you will miss it when it’s not there. Is it pretty? No. I can but refer back to my level at a County League standard where you invariably across 3 midfield players had one who could pass, one who could tackle and one who could run. You rarely if ever had a player at that level who could excel at more than one element let alone all three. The broader message is ….sorry it comes with who we have decided to be and in truth many supporters believe we should be. I am not arguing whether it is right or wrong but have added elsewhere a lengthy post on seasons expectations. That's bang on the money. |
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 11, 2024 13:28:51 GMT
I think grapevine49 is on the money. I too am a bit surprised that Campbell is starting, but the key here is not so much the player’s ability in some abstract sense but what it is Jones wants from his players both individually and collectively. Jones obviously sees something in Campbell (as he did in Anderson last season) and for me the big surprise is that he’s gone ahead of Kanu in the high pressing, willing runner role. Does Godden have the energy to play this role or will he be used primarily as a tactical and/or impact sub? I am not at all surprised that Campbell is starting. He scored four goals in pre season and looked threatening. I remain to be convinced by Ahadme considering the amount of money we spent on him. I see Godden is injured. With Leaburn coming back and Godden also returning we now have some options. I would give a few of the squad players a runout on Tuesday. We all know what Ahadme's game is and what suits him. He needs balls into the box, do that and he'll score goals, many of his total at Cambridege came with his head. He is a focal point, a target man and he is good at holding defenders off back to gaol and waiting for support to arrive. We are less likely to do trhat on teh road tahn we are at home but we do need to push players forward for it to happen. We didn't offer much going forward yesterday, I only saw us win teh second phas of play in and around the box once when Docherty nearly scored in the first half and that was it. You have to be high enough up the pitch to gie yourselves a chance of picking up the second ball when your attack breaks down. Anderson, Coventry and Docherty were far too deep for that to happen yesterday. Ahadme will come good but we need to play to his strengths. He's the guy for others around him to play off but he was isolated for much of yesterday's game. You should have come over and said hello dickplumb. I would have bought you a beer. |
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 11, 2024 13:32:47 GMT
I think it’s harsh on TC based on yesterday’s game. We’ve seen what he is capable of, did well for the goal and the setup last weekend Think he has potential but I agree with Dicky that I think we need more patience with him. That may be the case. I haven't had the opportunity to watch him during pre-season, they were just fitness matches which I stayed at home for and watched on the laptop. That said, friendlies are when you want to state your case as a player, perform well enough to make it hard for the manager not to pick you which he has based on those that have seen him in those games. Would he have played if we had Godden fit? I doubt it but as harsh as I may be sounding I can only base my opinion on what I see. I am happy however to bow to the genral opinion of him from those of you better qualified having watched him during the warm up games despite not being a player who has never really impresed me.. I think being tried in a diferent position tells us two things. The first is NJ wants to have back up for our forwards and the other is he obviously thinks we have better players in his natural position. Godden will undoubtedly slot straight back in when fit and if so what for TC then? I think he is the player most at risk if Raheim hits the ground running and proves to be everything we are told he is. |
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Post by garrynelson on Aug 11, 2024 14:26:39 GMT
I think it tells us, more likely, that NJ isn’t planning to utilize a set up which uses his natural position
Haven’t seen NJ try and use natural wingers much, if at all. Perhaps with Dixon that might change and become a plan B?
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Post by aaronaldo on Aug 11, 2024 19:26:58 GMT
Worth noting that Nathan confirmed TC was fighting an illness yesterday.
He’s a difficult one to judge. When he’s confident he’s great at dribbling with the ball and creating chances. I’m far less impressed with his finishing or end product. He definitely has potential and quite pacey when he wants to me.
I may be reading into it too much but I feel his better performances are usually in games he feels comfortable in. Home games more than not. If you see him interact on any of the Charlton training or media video’s he seems very shy. I get the feeling on the pitch that he’s quite easily intimidated. So he can be completely anonymous against teams which intimidate either through physicality or potentially their fan base being hostile etc.
If he wants to do well in this position then he needs to want to break beyond the defence more. Stretch the opposition defence and create options either for himself or others. We need someone with pace to force the opposition defence backwards. You only had to watch England play at the euro’s with Kane to see how easy it is to defend against when your attacking play is all in front of the defence.
What has surprised me is how he’s jumped ahead of Kanu in the pecking order. Especially when he was ill. How bad has Kanu been pre-season..?
Edit: TL:DR - I think it’s more a mental battle for TC to be the player he has shown potential to be.
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Post by Mundell on Aug 11, 2024 20:11:59 GMT
What has surprised me is how he’s jumped ahead of Kanu in the pecking order. Especially when he was ill. How bad has Kanu been pre-season..? That’s the big surprise for me too. Let’s hope it’s a big vote of confidence in Campbell and not a loss of confidence in Kanu. I suspect Jones is going to continue to be very hard to predict. |
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 11, 2024 20:35:24 GMT
Worth noting that Nathan confirmed TC was fighting an illness yesterday. He’s a difficult one to judge. When he’s confident he’s great at dribbling with the ball and creating chances. I’m far less impressed with his finishing or end product. He definitely has potential and quite pacey when he wants to me. I may be reading into it too much but I feel his better performances are usually in games he feels comfortable in. Home games more than not. If you see him interact on any of the Charlton training or media video’s he seems very shy. I get the feeling on the pitch that he’s quite easily intimidated. So he can be completely anonymous against teams which intimidate either through physicality or potentially their fan base being hostile etc. If he wants to do well in this position then he needs to want to break beyond the defence more. Stretch the opposition defence and create options either for himself or others. We need someone with pace to force the opposition defence backwards. You only had to watch England play at the euro’s with Kane to see how easy it is to defend against when your attacking play is all in front of the defence. What has surprised me is how he’s jumped ahead of Kanu in the pecking order. Especially when he was ill. How bad has Kanu been pre-season..? The illness isn't a worry. What is though is the fact he started ahead of players that may have been fitter. |
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Post by bexleyboy on Aug 12, 2024 5:38:23 GMT
Personally he has the ability to be a very dangerous striker , pace and running at defenders is a massive plus for any forward my only issue especially Saturday was he failed to read on flick on that Ahadme won but I suppose that’s part of learning this new role ..
Once Godden and Leaburn are back can only see Campbell being an impact sub .. and given us something different later in the game
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Post by chertseyaddick on Aug 12, 2024 15:48:35 GMT
TC has about 6 games as a striker. Has the press off to a tee. Give him some slack.
Wait until you see Dixon's closing down. Goals galore.
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Post by reamsofverse on Aug 13, 2024 8:10:29 GMT
TC has about 6 games as a striker. Has the press off to a tee. Give him some slack. Wait until you see Dixon's closing down. Goals galore. You are fully entitled to your opinion but I think I'm more comfortable sticking to my own. He's not a striker, he's only being used as one to save the board buying a player who is a natural in that position. That's not Campbell's fault it's their's. It's daft thinking otherwise. Have you seen Dixin's closing down? Not sure why you are using it as a comparison. I still think we are a striker short. We look good on paper up top but in reality it's flawed. One will soon be coming back from a significant injury, the type that could reoccur at any point. Ahadme and Godden both picked up niggles last season too. Kanu and Campbell are the back up learning on the job which should only be happening elsewhere on loan. The owners don't want to block the path of our youngsters but they have to be good enough first. That path cannot be in our first team instead of already established footballers who are good enough to have us in and around the top six all season. |
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