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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2022 19:56:11 GMT
If only CAST could get as worked up about how the club is being mismanaged.
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Post by seriouslyred on Jul 31, 2022 22:01:40 GMT
If only CAST could get as worked up about how the club is being mismanaged. Unfortunately CASTrust failed to maintain the values and definitions set by the founding board back in 2012/13. They aligned with CARD back in 2016 and lost all objectivity, culminating in their chair attacking Bowyer on the eve of our promotion season, two years later. It's always, always tempting to take the Brian Clough view of main board directors but some takes of our recent history suggest other perspectives are valid. |
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Post by smudge7946 on Jul 31, 2022 22:16:44 GMT
That’s also my view. The question is what do Generous Robots expect to get out of this? Their objective, obviously, is to increase the size of what they call their ‘community’ in order to boost demand for their tokens, ramping the price to the benefit of existing investors. Simply having their name on the back of our shorts isn’t going to do that so there must be something else involved here. They’ll no doubt believe that having a ‘relationship’ with Charlton will enhance their credibility and, in effect. endorse their business. From my perspective that’s bad enough, but I suspect they’ll be more. It seems possible the club will help market the tokens in some way and perhaps engage in some joint promotions, i.e. tokens/fund plus discounted shirts etc. Its bonkers and, as you say, further undermines the credibility and integrity of the owner. Just my perspective. Terms such as greenwashing and sportswashing have been around for a little while. What's the difference between a questionable business and a supposedly legitimate one sponsoring a football club? And why do they both do it? They all want exposure and to share the legitimacy of the brand. Sports betting companies have been doing this for a couple of decades at both club and league level. One could get into an in depth discussion about crypto, block chain and legitimate vs ponzi aspects but for me the shutters come down if a business is unregulated but promising returns on an investment. What is sportswashing and greenwashing? |
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Post by seriouslyred on Jul 31, 2022 22:48:57 GMT
Terms such as greenwashing and sportswashing have been around for a little while. What's the difference between a questionable business and a supposedly legitimate one sponsoring a football club? And why do they both do it? They all want exposure and to share the legitimacy of the brand. Sports betting companies have been doing this for a couple of decades at both club and league level. One could get into an in depth discussion about crypto, block chain and legitimate vs ponzi aspects but for me the shutters come down if a business is unregulated but promising returns on an investment. What is sportswashing and greenwashing? The Web is our friend! en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sportswashing#:~:text=Sportswashing%20is%20the%20practice%20of,participation%20in%20the%20sport%20itself. |
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Post by smudge7946 on Aug 1, 2022 6:25:53 GMT
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Post by Mundell on Aug 4, 2022 10:21:34 GMT
Charlton's tie up with Generous Robots was discussed briefly on the latest Price of Football podcast. Kieran Maguire was scathing and questioned the club's involvement. There was no insight or information not already linked on this thread, but Maguire focused on Generous Robots' complete lack of transparency and Ponzi Scheme potential.
At the risk of repeating what has already been said, when thinking about this sponsorship it is really important to distinguish between the technology behind crypto, NFTs et al, and the potential use cases for it, on the one hand, and the risks to 'users' which are inherent in a complex and completely unregulated environment, on the other.
In an ideal world, the technology will improve real world outcomes and it is entirely possible that some types of NFTs will become commonplace, though our experience of them will likely meld in other applications we use so that we may not even be conscious we are using an 'NFT'. Unfortunately, in the meantime, there is huge scope for 'Get rich quick schemes', some of which may be genuine but unsound (keep your fingers crossed, some mug will buy this off you later at a higher price) while others will be fraudulent, cons or Ponzi Schemes of one kind or another.
As far as Generous Robots is concerned, there are a number of red flags which point to the latter possibility. At the risk of being overly cynical, I'd be surprised if the club has conducted extensive due diligence, if for no other reason than its unlikely Generous Robots would have been open to that. That does the club, and its owner, no credit in my view.
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Post by floydroadse7 on Aug 4, 2022 13:58:57 GMT
Another embarrassing episode for the club. Just when you think they can't sink any lower - turns out they can! Things like this just leave such a sour taste, it just strikes of poor decision making at the top, something that should not come as a surprise!
I could convince myself of getting behind it if I saw reasonable reinvestment back into the club, but any money here will quickly disappear much like the Pope money. TS is a charlatan, a fraud and a danger to this club.
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Post by revilo on Aug 5, 2022 9:41:48 GMT
Last week the club announced a new partnership with Generous Robots.
Following the announcement, we received a few queries from supporters about the nature of the partnership. Regular communication with supporters is very important to us, so we wanted to respond to some of the questions we have been getting.
Did the club do its due diligence when signing the agreement with Generous Robots?
Before any partnership contract is signed the club does a thorough evaluation of a potential partner. This partnership with Generous Robots was looked at from a variety of different angles and we felt it was a good partnership for the club. It is a one-year deal at this stage, and we will continue to evaluate as the relationship develops.
Will Generous Robots contact Charlton fans directly through the club’s database?
While the partnership does include the branding on men’s first-team shorts and an opportunity for website and social media posts, Generous Robots does not have or be given access to our club database to market directly to our supporters.
What protection will Charlton be offering to supporters, especially those aged under 18?
The club have carried out due diligence on the partnership and, encourage supporters become informed as well. Supporters will make their own decisions regarding participation with any products at their own risk and we would like to remind them that any outlay could go down or up in value. Supporters are advised not to spend more than they can afford to lose. Therefore, we encourage supporters thinking about involvement with NFTs, or other products, do their own research and due diligence.
Supporters should be aware that the Generous Robots logo will not be on the shorts of our women’s first-team kit, replica kits or academy kits.
Charlton Owner and CEO Thomas Sandgaard said: “We appreciate the world of NFTs is new and for some supporters may be a bit scary. That is natural, and I was unsure as well when the proposal first landed on my desk. I have done my research though and spoken to people who I trust and am comfortable with the partnership. We’ll continue to evaluate and, where possible, offer information and education to supporters but we would strongly encourage supporters to do their own research with any company or products they are unfamiliar with.”
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Post by Mundell on Aug 5, 2022 11:52:30 GMT
Last week the club announced a new partnership with Generous Robots. Following the announcement, we received a few queries from supporters about the nature of the partnership. Regular communication with supporters is very important to us, so we wanted to respond to some of the questions we have been getting. Did the club do its due diligence when signing the agreement with Generous Robots? Before any partnership contract is signed the club does a thorough evaluation of a potential partner. This partnership with Generous Robots was looked at from a variety of different angles and we felt it was a good partnership for the club. It is a one-year deal at this stage, and we will continue to evaluate as the relationship develops. Will Generous Robots contact Charlton fans directly through the club’s database? While the partnership does include the branding on men’s first-team shorts and an opportunity for website and social media posts, Generous Robots does not have or be given access to our club database to market directly to our supporters. What protection will Charlton be offering to supporters, especially those aged under 18? The club have carried out due diligence on the partnership and, encourage supporters become informed as well. Supporters will make their own decisions regarding participation with any products at their own risk and we would like to remind them that any outlay could go down or up in value. Supporters are advised not to spend more than they can afford to lose. Therefore, we encourage supporters thinking about involvement with NFTs, or other products, do their own research and due diligence. Supporters should be aware that the Generous Robots logo will not be on the shorts of our women’s first-team kit, replica kits or academy kits. Charlton Owner and CEO Thomas Sandgaard said: “We appreciate the world of NFTs is new and for some supporters may be a bit scary. That is natural, and I was unsure as well when the proposal first landed on my desk. I have done my research though and spoken to people who I trust and am comfortable with the partnership. We’ll continue to evaluate and, where possible, offer information and education to supporters but we would strongly encourage supporters to do their own research with any company or products they are unfamiliar with.” Hmmm. Caveat emptor isn't really a great defence. |
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Post by kings hill addick on Aug 5, 2022 12:39:40 GMT
Last week the club announced a new partnership with Generous Robots. Following the announcement, we received a few queries from supporters about the nature of the partnership. Regular communication with supporters is very important to us, so we wanted to respond to some of the questions we have been getting. Did the club do its due diligence when signing the agreement with Generous Robots? Before any partnership contract is signed the club does a thorough evaluation of a potential partner. This partnership with Generous Robots was looked at from a variety of different angles and we felt it was a good partnership for the club. It is a one-year deal at this stage, and we will continue to evaluate as the relationship develops. Will Generous Robots contact Charlton fans directly through the club’s database? While the partnership does include the branding on men’s first-team shorts and an opportunity for website and social media posts, Generous Robots does not have or be given access to our club database to market directly to our supporters. What protection will Charlton be offering to supporters, especially those aged under 18? The club have carried out due diligence on the partnership and, encourage supporters become informed as well. Supporters will make their own decisions regarding participation with any products at their own risk and we would like to remind them that any outlay could go down or up in value. Supporters are advised not to spend more than they can afford to lose. Therefore, we encourage supporters thinking about involvement with NFTs, or other products, do their own research and due diligence. Supporters should be aware that the Generous Robots logo will not be on the shorts of our women’s first-team kit, replica kits or academy kits. Charlton Owner and CEO Thomas Sandgaard said: “We appreciate the world of NFTs is new and for some supporters may be a bit scary. That is natural, and I was unsure as well when the proposal first landed on my desk. I have done my research though and spoken to people who I trust and am comfortable with the partnership. We’ll continue to evaluate and, where possible, offer information and education to supporters but we would strongly encourage supporters to do their own research with any company or products they are unfamiliar with.” I wonder if the due dilligance that was carried out was done so by the same person that thought is was ok to sign Charlie Kirk just after his father passed away, or who thought it was a good idea to give Chuks 'Sick Note' Aneke a three and a half year deal? |
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Post by Mundell on Aug 6, 2022 10:49:05 GMT
I'm conscious that its probably not a good look to have a disproportionate number of the posts on any one thread, but I'm unable to resist one more observation. Martin Calladine has tweeted another set of absolutely scathing comments. This is in response to the club's statement, linked here , which essentially says that fans need to take care of themselves. Two of Calladine's strongest statements are as follows, "In my view, it is grossly irresponsible for Charlton to try and pass off responsibility for this partnership onto fans like this by saying DYOR". "Charlton have f*cked up and their fans are going to pay the price". Its hard to disagree with him, though I suspect he's wrong about fans paying the price. I'd be surprised if any fans bother to 'invest' so that the result is more likely to be an early end to an unholy marriage which should never have been blessed in the first place. Calladine's focus is primarily on GR's complete lack of transparency and he's not wrong to say that due diligence is impossible. The main concern from my perspective is the fact that there is no obvious way GR's investment can pay the income promised to investors except via nefarious means. It's an obvious scam. Bizarrely you might think, I watched the circa one hour long interview with the man behind the mask, that's the Russian named Tim, and learnt precisely nothing. It was mostly nonsense. I'm not sure who was worse, Dr No or the crazed zealot doing the interview, but there was no discussion of anything of substance and certainly no probing of what GR actually does or how it works. There is some crazy stuff going on, off the grid, and some of it completely detached from reality. I do not believe for one minute that Thomas Sandgaard has done anything like full due diligence on Generous Robots. The impression given is that he doesn't care. The sponsorship promises to pay him a sum of money and the fans can look after themselves. That's a damning indictment of his integrity in my view. Just my perspective. |
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Post by newyorkaddick on Aug 6, 2022 19:05:16 GMT
Interesting that Robots DAO was also prominent on the electronic advertising boards too....embarrassing and ridiculous.
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Post by smudge7946 on Aug 9, 2022 13:13:03 GMT
The club have done well here and deserve to be defended. Quite rightly the club have said its our money and you can spend it how you see fit. We don't live in Russia. I wish anyone who is daft enough to invest in this nonsense the very best of luck. Please let us know how you get on.
At the risk of sounding a
tinsey bit sexist, Its probably sensible to not advertise on the women's shorts. Girls only spend money on groceries, shoes and handbags. They don't want to worry their pretty heads about the big world of crypto investment. Blokes can worry about this and the ladies can focus on little floofy kittens because they are all fluffy and cute.
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Post by revilo on Aug 10, 2022 9:13:59 GMT
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Post by revilo on Aug 31, 2022 18:44:27 GMT
Sandgaard saw sense
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Post by kings hill addick on Sept 1, 2022 14:38:40 GMT
I would laugh so hard if it comes out that the Robot people never paid the club and shafted them. |
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Post by tonyshootersbull on Sept 1, 2022 15:15:04 GMT
There advertising is still on the electric boards around the pitch.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2022 18:24:29 GMT
I would laugh so hard if it comes out that the Robot people never paid the club and shafted them. Weird support that |
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Post by kings hill addick on Sept 2, 2022 14:25:10 GMT
I would laugh so hard if it comes out that the Robot people never paid the club and shafted them. Weird support that I don’t like a lot of the things that Sandgaard has done but this association risks less financially sophisticated fans investing because the club ‘vouch’ for it. Sandgaard’s response was that they had carried out their due diligence (which I doubted at the time) and that the fans should do the same - even though the club are advertising (recommending) them on the players shorts and the advertising hoardings. If it transpires that Sandgaard’s due diligence was so slap dash that he failed to take into account that he might not get paid then, yes, I will find that funny! |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 15:19:07 GMT
I don’t like a lot of the things that Sandgaard has done but this association risks less financially sophisticated fans investing because the club ‘vouch’ for it. Sandgaard’s response was that they had carried out their due diligence (which I doubted at the time) and that the fans should do the same - even though the club are advertising (recommending) them on the players shorts and the advertising hoardings. If it transpires that Sandgaard’s due diligence was so slap dash that he failed to take into account that he might not get paid then, yes, I will find that funny! Agree with all that except the final para. If he gets hit financially we get hit financially (as demonstrated with our dramatic turnaround of “financial strategy” at the club |
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Post by Mundell on Oct 5, 2023 19:59:24 GMT
I’ve just started to read the Michael Lewis book on Sam Bankman-Fried. I don’t know how much Lewis will get into the massive fraud Bankman-Fried committed, but so far it’s all about Sam who so far is coming across as a complete nutcase. A likeable nutcase, perhaps, but a nutcase nevertheless. It’s Michael Lewis (Liars Poker, The New New Thing, Moneyball, The Big Short etc.) at his brilliant best. Anyway, starting the book reminded me of the nutcases at Generous Robots and the preposterous Russian in hoody and dark glasses. Dumping GR (if it was that way around) is probably just about the only sensible thing Thomas Sandgaard ever did. Anyway, I wondered what had happened to them and found this classic piece of bullshit, “Although, when Generous Robots first launched, everything about the project was highly anticipated and well-received, the perception has since changed. The team understands that the art has fallen short of expectations, the initial utility no longer holds the same relevance, and the staking mechanisms have numerous flaws. Hence, the launch of a new collection is crucial. This is our chance to align with the current standards of Solana NFTs and establish ourselves as a strong competitor in the market, instead of being just another average project.” Quelle surprise!! I’ve linked the latest White Paper here. for any nerds like me who might be remotely interested. It’s classic stuff!! How people fall for this crap is completely beyond me. |
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