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Post by wellingaddick on Feb 15, 2020 21:19:59 GMT
Leaving aside our inexplicably poor record and performances in these games, does the club really benefit? It is likely that 99% of those extra fans will not be back next week and I can't recall a spike in attendances, following these games in the past. If the club's intention, is to try and bring these fans back week after week, then it is something that has not worked for years.
The club probably made an extra 50k through the gate and likely the same on merchandise, food and drink and programmes. That has to be offset with the opening of the closed sections plus the cost of extra staff at the kiosks and stewarding. Is whatever money leftover any relevance at all for the club in this day and age?
The atmosphere today was very poor in comparison with the rest of the season. Why would that be, when there was an extra 10k 'fans' in the stadium? There are currently stories on social media of fights breaking out, fans wearing other team's colours and drunk guys smoking in the toilets. Do we want these type of 'fans' at all, even for just one game? My own experience of today was a guy sitting in front of me, constantly leaving his seat throughout the game and finally leaving with over 10 minutes remaining. I really wondered what was the point of him bothering.
Personally I can't see any advantage in football for a fiver, unless the club is that desperate for the few extra pounds the game brings in!
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Post by IpswichAddick on Feb 15, 2020 21:31:21 GMT
Leaving aside our inexplicably poor record and performances in these games, does the club really benefit? It is likely that 99% of those extra fans will not be back next week and I can't recall a spike in attendances, following these games in the past. If the club's intention, is to try and bring these fans back week after week, then it is something that has not worked for years. The club probably made an extra 50k through the gate and likely the same on merchandise, food and drink and programmes. That has to be offset with the opening of the closed sections plus the cost of extra staff at the kiosks and stewarding. Is whatever money leftover any relevance at all for the club in this day and age? The atmosphere today was very poor in comparison with the rest of the season. Why would that be, when there was an extra 10k 'fans' in the stadium? There are currently stories on social media of fights breaking out, fans wearing other team's colours and drunk guys smoking in the toilets. Do we want these type of 'fans' at all, even for just one game? My own experience of today was a guy sitting in front of me, constantly leaving his seat throughout the game and finally leaving with over 10 minutes remaining. I really wondered what was the point of him bothering. Personally I can't see any advantage in football for a fiver, unless the club is that desperate for the few extra pounds the game brings in! Fight broke out next to me. Some old and young fella had a go and the young guy swung like a madman. Bit harsh in my opinion. Nearly got shoved to the floor but what can you do?! We don’t want these plastic fans and it’s Saddening that we have fans like this. I know you get them everywhere but I haven’t seen a fight like this in a while |
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Post by ExeterAddick on Feb 15, 2020 21:58:06 GMT
Football for a fiver games are always dreadful. People turning up late, unable to find their seats, then heading out at 35 minutes for a pie. Non-existent atmosphere as well.
I get why the club does it, but they’re always grim affairs for long time season ticket holders.
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Post by dartford36 on Feb 15, 2020 22:06:05 GMT
Tend to agree with the sentiment, but if we’d won the opinion would no doubt be different. As a marketing ploy it’s good business for the club but when it all falls flat as a cow pat on the pitch whatever benefit has been obtained financially is utterly wasted if the team puts in a lamentable performance and fails to live up to expectations.
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Post by jonkool on Feb 15, 2020 22:10:15 GMT
Football for a fiver games are always dreadful. People turning up late, unable to find their seats, then heading out at 35 minutes for a pie. Non-existent atmosphere as well. I get why the club does it, but they’re always grim affairs for long time season ticket holders. Very sadly I have to agree with you Exeter. We lose/the place is heaving with people who are far from committed/it takes 10 mins to have a pee/queues for burgers and entry. It’s just hard blimmin work with little reward! |
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Post by dartford36 on Feb 15, 2020 22:14:07 GMT
Football for a fiver games are always dreadful. People turning up late, unable to find their seats, then heading out at 35 minutes for a pie. Non-existent atmosphere as well. I get why the club does it, but they’re always grim affairs for long time season ticket holders. Very sadly I have to agree with you Exeter. We lose/the place is heaving with people who are far from committed/it takes 10 mins to have a pee/queues for burgers and entry. It’s just hard blimmin work with little reward! The irony is though that we want the club to be successful, challenging at the top of the league which of course should bring in bigger crowds and thus all the discomfort you describe. But of course your tongue was firmly in your cheeks when you said it, wasn’t it😀 |
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Post by ExeterAddick on Feb 15, 2020 22:33:56 GMT
Very sadly I have to agree with you Exeter. We lose/the place is heaving with people who are far from committed/it takes 10 mins to have a pee/queues for burgers and entry. It’s just hard blimmin work with little reward! The irony is though that we want the club to be successful, challenging at the top of the league which of course should bring in bigger crowds and thus all the discomfort you describe. But of course your tongue was firmly in your cheeks when you said it, wasn’t it😀 The crowds we got in the Premier League were very different to the football for a fiver mob, for some reason. Same with the Donny play off game last season |
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Post by lightning on Feb 15, 2020 22:40:13 GMT
The irony is though that we want the club to be successful, challenging at the top of the league which of course should bring in bigger crowds and thus all the discomfort you describe. But of course your tongue was firmly in your cheeks when you said it, wasn’t it😀 The crowds we got in the Premier League were very different to the football for a fiver mob, for some reason. Same with the Donny play off game last season Very good point. It is a different crowd with the cheap tickets. I know a fair few who went today and aren’t fans. Makes for a strange atmosphere. |
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Post by seriouslyred on Feb 15, 2020 23:17:02 GMT
Theres no extra revenue and the place is full of day trippers plus queues at the bars and traffic after the game is a real pain...
Hang on! Since the takeover, the average gate is now 20,000! Remember when Bows took over two years back and it was 10,000?
Some of those fans might come but many won't - not really a problem. But seeing as it was sold out, the box office might do tickets for a tenner next time?
Personally delighted to sit in a full Valley at least once a season. I think this 20,000 average can only help raise more investment - we need that and more commercial revenue so as to kick on.
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Post by thevalleybest on Feb 15, 2020 23:23:26 GMT
queues at the bars and traffic after the game?.Other clubs have bigger attendance and don't worry about this.
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Post by thevalleybest on Feb 15, 2020 23:25:23 GMT
Millwall want 34,000 I am reading.
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Post by pardew123 on Feb 15, 2020 23:36:30 GMT
I agree we can’t play with full house don’t know why I say scrap it fans will come back with better players and performances in long run
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Post by thevalleybest on Feb 15, 2020 23:40:39 GMT
What is our real fan base amount we have 10,000 season ticket holders altogether with who follow us on TV etc would you say 40,000? Or more?.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 16, 2020 3:17:18 GMT
I can understand that 'Football for a Fiver' is seen as an attractive marketing tool by the Club.
But I think it should be deployed in a better way.
Can't see the point myself in having it on a nasty stormy February day against Blackburn Rovers.
Makes more sense to me to have FFAF in late August or September, when hopefully the weather is still decent and hopes for the season are still relatively high (and injuries relatively low).
If the team gets a result then, some of those 'plastic' £5 paying fans might really think about coming along to more games over the following few weeks.
We'd have a better chance of retaining some and converting them into regular supporters than holding the event when we do at the moment.
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Post by oisalmon74 on Feb 16, 2020 4:25:17 GMT
I couldn’t be there yesterday as away on holiday. However, my sister (mid 40s like me) has the season ticket next to mine and has been coming to the valley for nearly 20 years. She is no shrinking violet and tries to do 2-3 away games a season. she normally comes to games with a friend or her non-footballing hubby when I can’t go because of work.
she refuses to attend football for a fiver days because she can’t stand the atmosphere, negativity and idiots who can’t handle their shandy or find a seat.
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Post by hairyhotdog on Feb 16, 2020 6:19:46 GMT
Everyone is entitled to their opinions but I for one loved looking out from my upper north seat and seeing the East and West stands full to the rafters...
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Post by cafc2002 on Feb 16, 2020 8:00:32 GMT
Was surrounded by idiots yesterday who came in late at the start and after half time and had no interest in what was going on at all. Ground was full of passionless supporters who were only there for a cheap day out, keep kids for a quid and do this more often they're the future.
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Post by wellingaddick on Feb 16, 2020 8:46:45 GMT
Was surrounded by idiots yesterday who came in late at the start and after half time and had no interest in what was going on at all. Ground was full of passionless supporters who were only there for a cheap day out, keep kids for a quid and do this more often they're the future. Two or maybe even three 'Kids for a quid' games a season would in my view, be more beneficial to the club, than the current arrangement. |
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Post by somerton on Feb 16, 2020 10:05:34 GMT
Football for a fiver a waste of time. It will not encourage any one to become a Charlton fan or to regularly attend matches.i brought a mate who is a West Ham season ticket holder he not going to be a za Addick ever. It was just a good day out for him and me with a lot of beer involved.I suspect that is the same for many Charlton season ticket holders yesterday.the big down side is the dampened on the atmosphere the interlopers bring to the game.
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Post by earlpurple on Feb 16, 2020 10:19:29 GMT
How about doing Football for a Fiver for a midweek game for once, given some of us can't go on Saturdays?
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Post by divot on Feb 16, 2020 15:15:11 GMT
Have to say I'm not a fan of it. We might pick up some floating fans but season holders like me do get pissed off with large numbers of wallies. At least make it "Football for a Tenner" next season and see what happens.
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Post by seriouslyred on Feb 16, 2020 23:23:57 GMT
What is our real fan base amount we have 10,000 season ticket holders altogether with who follow us on TV etc would you say 40,000? Or more?. Depends what we mean by fanbase... ST holders have been around 10,000 for most seasons since the parachute monies ran out in 2009. And there might be 15-20,000 who regularly go to some games every season - either 2/3, 5-8 or 10-12. The marketing challenge is to get existing fans to go more often AND introduce new fans every season. With the database, loyalty points and online sales, the club is well equipped to build a precise listing of all types of fans... Time will tell if attendances continue to rise? They've certainly gone up over the last two years. If the club add some real talent over the summer then perhaps the gates will climb even higher... and there will be less tickets available for promotions? |
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Post by wellingaddick on Feb 17, 2020 9:49:46 GMT
What is our real fan base amount we have 10,000 season ticket holders altogether with who follow us on TV etc would you say 40,000? Or more?. Depends what we mean by fanbase... ST holders have been around 10,000 for most seasons since the parachute monies ran out in 2009. And there might be 15-20,000 who regularly go to some games every season - either 2/3, 5-8 or 10-12. The marketing challenge is to get existing fans to go more often AND introduce new fans every season. With the database, loyalty points and online sales, the club is well equipped to build a precise listing of all types of fans... Time will tell if attendances continue to rise? They've certainly gone up over the last two years. If the club add some real talent over the summer then perhaps the gates will climb even higher... and there will be less tickets available for promotions? Success on the pitch will always be the most effective marketing ploy. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2020 10:13:14 GMT
Have to say I'm not a fan of it. We might pick up some floating fans but season holders like me do get pissed off with large numbers of wallies. At least make it "Football for a Tenner" next season and see what happens. Much better idea. |
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Post by mikebassett on Feb 17, 2020 10:22:35 GMT
FFAF doesn't effect results. Yeah, we might lose more of these games than we win (I haven't checked tbh), but given the turnover of playing staff on an annual basis, I can't see how you can attribute FFAF to losing games.
I'd be interested to know the finances of a FFAF Day at the club. The average attendance figure I've found online is 18,078 for the season. That's probably distorted by a couple of offers we've had recently but nevertheless, I'll go with that. Lets say we have 10k STH. That might be over the top, it might be conservative but, oh well.
That leaves 8,078, made up of those without ST's, away fans and those whose situation determines when they can attend. Average ticket cost, lets say £20 based upon some paying top end (£31), others paying the cheaper cost (£20) and kids and OAP's (anything from £5-£20+). That's without hospitality that costs more etc but just to look at this as basic as possible, I'm going with £20 as ab average. £20 x 8,078 = £161,560.00 per game.
Now with Saturday's attendance of 25,363, that's 15,363 non-ST holders buying tickets for £5. £5 x 15,363 = £76,815.00. There's an approximately £85,000 difference between the two figures there. To make up that gap between the figures, we'd need each of the 15,363 to spend £5.52, but that's taking into account that the 8,078 spend £0 when they attend, which they obviously don't.
Just from a business perspective, I can't see how, in the short-term, the day makes sense from a business perspective. Long-term, does it equate to higher attendances and more income? It doesn't naturally appear so.
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Post by divot on Feb 17, 2020 11:59:37 GMT
I wonder if any of the matchday food and drink income actually goes to CAFC or whether we've already had our money in the form of rent, while the operation is subbed out?
If there is no beverage income on the day to the club, I guess at least the promise of a big take does make it more appealing when tendering the contracts for the food outlets.
Overall though, I can't see it makes much commercial sense to carry on at £5 (plus it IS a small kick in the teeth for season holders). Go for £10 and hopefully, you'd get the right sort of balance.
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Post by seriouslyred on Feb 17, 2020 15:32:28 GMT
Many have tried to calculate the benefit of catering and football for a fiver sales but the numbers are simply not material! The reality is that with VAT excluded it takes an additional 3,000 fans on the average over the season to generate an additional £1M revenue over the season.
Put that in perspective and our losses have been 5-8M a season most of the time. And taking our squad up to mid-table and above might cost another £10M a season!
Equity, debt and an increase in commercial sponsorship revenue might assist. And these are more likely as the football improves and the crowds grow.
However, several clubs have run into trouble "chasing the dream" as Ridsdale called it since failure can lead to a massive reduction in revenue streams.
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Post by thevalleybest on Feb 17, 2020 16:23:20 GMT
Many have tried to calculate the benefit of catering and football for a fiver sales but the numbers are simply not material! The reality is that with VAT excluded it takes an additional 3,000 fans on the average over the season to generate an additional £1M revenue over the season. Put that in perspective and our losses have been 5-8M a season most of the time. And taking our squad up to mid-table and above might cost another £10M a season! Equity, debt and an increase in commercial sponsorship revenue might assist. And these are more likely as the football improves and the crowds grow. However, several clubs have run into trouble "chasing the dream" as Ridsdale called it since failure can lead to a massive reduction in revenue streams. It's not really £5 they add a booking fee of £1.50 also. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2020 16:50:09 GMT
Maybe cheap creates a precedent. Hard to argue with when you look back at all our fiver games.
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