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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 23, 2015 22:20:58 GMT
A lot of discussion and valid points but sometimes it gets bogged down in regrets and arguments about what happened in the past... So a new approach.
Assuming M.Duchatelet continues with his funding of the club at £10m a year to cover losses and new player acquisitions what do you see as key decisions and where do you see us in March 2016?
Is it acceptable for the club to sell one or two of our five (yes five!) high value players to help balance the books OR should we go all out for the play-offs next time.
Similarly should they go easy on the budgetted losses OR do everything it takes to retain Bulot and Buyens plus push on with high calibre expensive signings.... In the full knowledge that increased crowds simply won't pay the bills so player sales are inevitable if we don't get promoted.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2015 23:09:11 GMT
can see Watt + 1 going to balance the books , I posted some time ago the ins and outs from RD's clubs, there is a high turn over , tho I dont claim to know how good / bad the players are.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 23, 2015 23:11:30 GMT
Firstly I think there will be quite a few players sold/released over the summer and my list would be something like this:
Harriot, Onyewu, Wilson, Church, Reza, Parzyszek, Daniel, Munns, Nego, Cumberbatch, Etheridge, Tucudean, Bikey.
Bulot and Buyens will stay so then it comes to the new incoming players who if it was down to me would include some of the names below.
English based:
Aden Flint (Centre Back - Bristol City)
Craig Noone (Right/Left winger - Cardiff City)
Harry Arter (Central Midfielder - Bournemouth)
Will Grigg (Striker - MK Dons)
Sam Mantom (Central midfielder - Wallsall)
Patrick Bamford (Striker - Chelsea **LOAN**)
Dele Ali (Central Midfielder - Tottenham **LOAN**)
European:
Wissam Ben Yedder (Striker - Toulouse)
Claudio Beauvue (Midfielder - Guingamp)
Ryan Thomas (Winger - PEC Zwolle)
Tomer Hemed (Striker - Almeria)
Baptiste Guillaume (Stiker/Midfielder - RSC Lens) .....Keep an eye on this one.
Standard Liege Loans:
Geoffrey Mujangi Bia (Left sided Midfielder)
Julian De Sart (Defensive Midfielder)
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 23, 2015 23:12:23 GMT
can see Watt + 1 going to balance the books , I posted some time ago the ins and outs from RD's clubs, there is a high turn over , tho I dont claim to know how good / bad the players are. Watt won't leave. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2015 23:16:01 GMT
Thought he may well be our highest valued asset if he keeps scoring ,,, just a thought
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 23, 2015 23:22:26 GMT
I really don't think any of our big guns will leave, Gomez possibly but what we get for him will be put towards a competitive transfer kitty for Championship level.
I reckon we'll spend £5- £6m over the summer.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2015 23:25:56 GMT
Firstly I think there will be quite a few players sold/released over the summer and my list would be something like this: Harriot, Onyewu, Wilson, Church, Reza, Parzyszek, Daniel, Munns, Nego, Cumberbatch, Etheridge, Tucudean, Bikey. Funnily enough, I reckon Church is the one worth keeping from that list, if he's prepared to sit on the bench as back-up to Vetokele, Watt and hopefully one other incoming striker.... |
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Post by squareball on Mar 23, 2015 23:25:58 GMT
If think RD should hang onto our best players for 1 more season , add a bit of quality to it and see it brings the reward of top flight football. If not then sell on a few and reshape the squad and consolidate the season after that.
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 23, 2015 23:32:38 GMT
I hope Church stays but he won't if we are looking at other strikers.
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Post by ExeterAddick on Mar 23, 2015 23:34:40 GMT
I don't think we've got anyone who would attract Premiership interest. Possibly Gomez with his potential, Hendo as a reserve and maybe JBG due to some of his displays (although I don't think he's consistent enough for the Prem). This could mean that our main threat comes from abroad, with players like Igor and Ben Haim maybe getting their heads turned by some overseas money.
If we can keep the core together (Hendo, Solly, Tal, Gomez, Cousins, JBG, Bulot, Watt, Vetokele) and add another 4 quality players, a few to bulk out the squad, supplemented by the likes of Wiggins, Harriott, Jackson, etc - then I think we'd have a squad capable of a playoff finish.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2015 7:39:31 GMT
If Gomez or Cousins were to leave I'd expect £10 million pound for each. The club have always let their youngsters go cheap even the average ones. Especially with the new TV deal in place.
With the majority of this money we can build a promotion winning squad.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2015 8:44:12 GMT
I have to agree here that we'd be best at keeping our best players not only for quality but for consistency too.. Problem is if a player wants to leave they generally get their wish (Scotty) and I can't see Luzon wanting people about who aren't fighting for the cause... Like a lot say on here it will be an interesting summer but this time for the right reasons... Players will attract fans and fans will bring revenue... I can't see there being a huge issue with season tickets as people support a team and if the team is progressing most would want to be part of that...
For those who doubt, look at the past 6 weeks to see how things have changed... It was just about being patient and believing in the new regime ( something about Rome here).
COYR
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 24, 2015 9:33:52 GMT
I think Gomez, Cousins, Watt, Vetokele and Gudmundsson are all possible sales but they won't be for small beer. I'd love it if we sold nobody and kept building the squad because current form suggests we can climb the table... As long as we buy or borrow the right quality cover.
I wonder if they will strengthen the back five and there are obviously still choices to make like Ben Haim or Johnson to be renewed. I see Buyens has changed his angle and now saying he might stay.
And, as Reams states, anyone not good enough for the squad will be sold. Or perhaps loaned to St Truiden?
If we keep going, keep climbing, then the club can promote season tickets and matches to all those who have drifted away or only come occasionally on the basis we will achieve our highest finish for nine years.
Bottom line is that it's good to be talking about the gap between us and the top six just 12 months after we were bottom of the league.
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Post by bexleyboy on Mar 24, 2015 10:45:35 GMT
We have had two offers already for Watt one was a loan deal both turned diown by the club.. .....
Add Jackson to the our list and I think question has to be asked about Solly and Wiggins given there injury issues
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Post by americanaddick on Mar 24, 2015 11:37:27 GMT
If Gomez or Cousins were to leave I'd expect £10 million pound for each. The club have always let their youngsters go cheap even the average ones. Especially with the new TV deal in place. With the majority of this money we can build a promotion winning squad. Cousins is in no way worth that much. |
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Post by MurciaAl on Mar 24, 2015 14:30:08 GMT
The one thing about RD that I am fairly certain of, if we do sell anyone, he will make sure we get top dollar.
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Post by squareball on Mar 24, 2015 14:42:37 GMT
I agree that Cousins is not worth that much but Gomez, whilst not worth that much yet has huge potential to play at the very top. I have to remind myself how young that lad is. Pure quality.
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 24, 2015 15:28:57 GMT
I agree that Cousins is not worth that much but Gomez, whilst not worth that much yet has huge potential to play at the very top. I have to remind myself how young that lad is. Pure quality. Yep - all five young talents (both academy and acquired) will be worth more if they stay with us longer. That's why I'm counting on no sales this summer. Later on if one of them goes for £5m then that's a years losses. Again that's a long way from the team declining and us selling our best for £1m. |
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Post by wellingaddick on Mar 24, 2015 21:35:47 GMT
can see Watt + 1 going to balance the books , I posted some time ago the ins and outs from RD's clubs, there is a high turn over , tho I dont claim to know how good / bad the players are. I too, think there will be a major sale to keep costs down. Just can't see any of the fringe players who are expected to leave, bring in a decent amount of money to avoid this. |
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 25, 2015 11:57:36 GMT
We are now in a position to bridge the gap to the top six next season but surely selling a top player or two will make that harder. And so reduce our chances of promotion.
I too can see it happening because many of the other top ten championship clubs have serious backing and will see some of our players as good enough to help them.
So when we do sell a player, will fans condemn it as short sighted or say that their club breaking even is the priority? I don't know what the fans view is but we know M.Duchatelet has form for selling players for €5-7m - he did that five times over last summer at Liege!
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Post by Guns Blazing on Mar 25, 2015 12:22:34 GMT
I think it's acceptable to sell for reinvestment purposes, i.e. sell Gomez for 7 million to buy two 28 year olds who can offer a push right now.
I don't think it's acceptable to sell the big guns if the final result isn't a stronger squad.
I'd also prefer to see them sold to non-Championship clubs, and preferably with a one season loan back to us in the case of Gomez or Cousins who wouldn't get into Premiership first teams right away.
I don't think breaking even this season should be a massive priority. Promotion is the way to permanent break-even.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2015 16:49:42 GMT
you think hes worth that much ? |
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Post by overthetop on Mar 25, 2015 20:45:22 GMT
you think hes worth that much ? I really do. He reminds me of a young Bobby Moore. |
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Post by seriouslyred on Mar 26, 2015 17:40:36 GMT
you think hes worth that much ? I really do. He reminds me of a young Bobby Moore. Someone might bid that much...and he'd be gone! But he probably needs more exposure? I think it's reasonable to state he might go for a price like that at some stage. Right now he's ideal for us since Solly can't play every game and we don't need to renew all the centre backs with him about. Depending on how we are going at Christmas we might be a buying or a selling club next January and that's when I can see big bids coming in for Gomez and others. |
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Post by Guns Blazing on Mar 26, 2015 18:00:31 GMT
you think hes worth that much ? No, not at all... but Premiership clubs will often pay above and beyond what a player is worth based on what they will one day be worth. I don't think we should sell him unless it's an offer we can't refuse. |
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Post by webbo on Mar 26, 2015 20:20:54 GMT
If a premier league club want to buy our player, given that each premier league match on it's own generates almost our whole years income, then Gomez or Cousins or whatever are certainly worth loads of money if a prem club comes sniffing. If they won't pay, don't sell (unless desperate of course). if it is true that West Ham or Newcastle for example want Morgan Fox then they can pay us £5million for him or bugger off.
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Post by jonkool on Mar 26, 2015 21:01:54 GMT
The key issue is whether Katrien thinks (after taking appropriate advice) that she is selling at an acceptable premium which we were not when selling Jonjo and Jenks? £5m for Foxy could offer a huge premium with young replacements developing fast within our Academy whilst £7m for Joe could be undervalued (long term injury risk accepted) unless huge add ons incorporated. I feel far more optimistic that when we sell we will no longer be selling for buttons!!  |
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Post by overthetop on Mar 26, 2015 22:41:54 GMT
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Post by reamsofverse on Mar 28, 2015 11:09:16 GMT
I never realised Sean O'Driscoll was the England U19 manager which explains why he was at Cardiff.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2015 18:18:26 GMT
We have had two offers already for Watt one was a loan deal both turned diown by the club.. ..... Add Jackson to the our list and I think question has to be asked about Solly and Wiggins given there injury issues Someone asked Charlton if they would loan Watt to them? That is not going to happen is it, that would suggest a problem with Watt and Charlton. I don't think that is the case. |
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